4 ms·

Has the boss brought someone in to replace you and said, "Okay, Coldtea, we found someone to replace you at your job. He's as good as you and he'll take a 10%

by crusso 9y ago

Has the boss brought someone in to replace you and said, "Okay, Coldtea, we found someone to replace you at your job. He's as good as you and he'll take a 10% cut in salary over what we pay you. Do you want to take a pay cut so you can stay?" That would be the upper hand. Before that, it's just a discussion.

sidlls 9y ago
That's the default situation, even in software, although more often it's in this form: "Okay, Jon Employee, our company had a bad quarter, we're going to have to ask employees to make some sacrifices." Then Jon Employee is laid off and subsequently has his position filled by somebody much more junior at far more than a 10% discount. This industry doesn't value engineering experience. It values breadth over depth. There are some exceptions. But the data are what they are.
- logfromblammo 9y ago
  It happens every time a company has more than one person who is technically capable of doing the same job. Companies have to do this once they grow large enough, so that the company will survive if any one person in it is hit by a bus (or leaves for greener pastures). Every day I go to work, the implied threat is that my company could assign all my work to someone cheaper--generally speaking, give 1/Nth of my work to each of my N co-workers, then advertise an open position if that puts the team over capacity--and abruptly end our work-for-pay relationship. Or maybe they allow a tester to jump up into development, and give them tester+1 pay instead of developer pay. If I meet with my manager with competing offer in hand, that may invert the status quo of the power balance for all of 15 minutes. How unnerving for them. You always need the company more than the company needs you. That's a corollary to the whole point of having a company, which is to produce an entity separate from and greater than its constituent parts. Personally, I'd just keep silent about the amount of the competing offer and ask for a raise. They can do their own calculations about how much they can afford to give, and if they can't match the competing offer without knowing what it is, I'd take it. Telling them what that offer is makes as much sense as divulging your salary history when seeking out competing offers, which is to say it does not make sense. Let companies do their own calculation regarding how much you are worth to them, instead of copying the answers off of each other.
coldtea 9y ago
The bosses do that all the time. And if it wasn't for training delays and costs, they'd do it in a heartbeat. Besides, that's exactly how they gauge what kind of wages to offer when they hire you -- from what others would accept in your place.

by crusso 9y ago

sidlls 9y ago

That's the default situation, even in software, although more often it's in this form: "Okay, Jon Employee, our company had a bad quarter, we're going to have to ask employees to make some sacrifices." Then Jon Employee is laid off and subsequently has his position filled by somebody much more junior at far more than a 10% discount. This industry doesn't value engineering experience. It values breadth over depth. There are some exceptions. But the data are what they are.

logfromblammo 9y ago
It happens every time a company has more than one person who is technically capable of doing the same job. Companies have to do this once they grow large enough, so that the company will survive if any one person in it is hit by a bus (or leaves for greener pastures). Every day I go to work, the implied threat is that my company could assign all my work to someone cheaper--generally speaking, give 1/Nth of my work to each of my N co-workers, then advertise an open position if that puts the team over capacity--and abruptly end our work-for-pay relationship. Or maybe they allow a tester to jump up into development, and give them tester+1 pay instead of developer pay. If I meet with my manager with competing offer in hand, that may invert the status quo of the power balance for all of 15 minutes. How unnerving for them. You always need the company more than the company needs you. That's a corollary to the whole point of having a company, which is to produce an entity separate from and greater than its constituent parts. Personally, I'd just keep silent about the amount of the competing offer and ask for a raise. They can do their own calculations about how much they can afford to give, and if they can't match the competing offer without knowing what it is, I'd take it. Telling them what that offer is makes as much sense as divulging your salary history when seeking out competing offers, which is to say it does not make sense. Let companies do their own calculation regarding how much you are worth to them, instead of copying the answers off of each other.

coldtea 9y ago

The bosses do that all the time. And if it wasn't for training delays and costs, they'd do it in a heartbeat. Besides, that's exactly how they gauge what kind of wages to offer when they hire you -- from what others would accept in your place.