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This is the main application for Bitcoin IMO: custody and trade settlement in securities. I have wanted to do this exact thing, issue bonds on a blockchain for

This is the main application for Bitcoin IMO: custody and trade settlement in securities. I have wanted to do this exact thing, issue bonds on a blockchain for some industry or government, since I found out about Bitcoin. Unfortunately, I do not have the kinds of connections necessary to be in the same room as major corporate bond sellers. Between this news and the DTCC using blockchain for CDS it seems to me that Bitcoin is going to get left behind by the old world companies it sought to replace. Blockstream seems too happy to sit on their hands while the speculative value of Bitcoin increases, not realizing that the chance to actually matter in the world of finance is slipping through their fingers. Bad news for Bitcoin: http://m.nasdaq.com/article/dtcc-to-launch-blockchain-credit-default-swaps-reporting-in-early-2018-cm794771 http://m.nasdaq.com/article/dtcc-to-launch-blockchain-credit...

atomical 9y ago
Why wouldn't they use Ethereum?
- subway 9y ago
  It's more likely they would use their own private blockchain. (Something ethereumish, like JP Morgan's Quorum, or Hyperledger Fabric).
  - atomical 9y ago
    I was trying to draw that point out. Sometimes news like this is used to pump crypto coins.
    - jjn2009 9y ago
      hyperledger fabric is not a 'coin'.
- legolassexyman 9y ago
  Ethereum's main selling point is it lets you issue illegal unregistered securities. Why would a real company want to associate with that? Also the lead developer is some kid who believes very much in moving fast and breaking things. This philosophy may work for a social network site but not for other people's money. How many terrible bugs have been discovered in Ethereums short history? Too many. Additionally the size of its blockchain has already passed Bitcoin. It's file size is growing so fast and will pose a serious technical problem.
  - anilshanbhag 9y ago
    Ethereum's main selling point is it lets you issue illegal unregistered securities. => Well that is the whole point of being decentralized. Anyone can do anything allowed by EVM. Also the lead developer is some kid who believes very much in moving fast and breaking things. This philosophy may work for a social network site but not for other people's money. => Well they have improved significantly. There are 3 implementations - one each in cpp, go and py. There are multiple miner implementation. It is significantly more mature and many people involved. See https://github.com/ethereum/go-ethereum https://github.com/ethereum/go-ethereum for example. 'terrible bugs'? there was one terrible bug a long time ago Additionally the size of its blockchain has already passed Bitcoin. It's file size is growing so fast and will pose a serious technical problem. => Storage is not a problem. We get TB size drives now. Most people use online wallets. There are various pruning measures which reduce the size significantly. There are many proposals to handle scaling if it were to become bottleneck.
    - DennisP 9y ago
      Also a very popular implementation in Rust. https://parity.io/ https://parity.io/
  - atomical 9y ago
    Bitcoin is used for drugs, prostitution, and gambling. That terrible bug was the DAO, but that's the nature of the blockchain and applies to Bitcoin as well. If you want rollbacks you use a centralized server.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
bo1024 9y ago
> This is the main application for Bitcoin IMO: custody and trade settlement in securities. Could you explain what problem bitcoin (or blockchains in general) solve in this space, or what improvement they can bring?
- closeparen 9y ago
  You can't be trusted to self-certify what you own. Middlemen who are trusted to keep the records of who owns what charge fees for their services.
  - bo1024 9y ago
    Wow, interesting, I had no idea something like that would be a problem. Still seems surprising to me that whoever creates the blockchain couldn't just maintain the data structure as a centralized trusted authority, e.g. if they are going to be the one paying out the bond later anyway.
thisisit 9y ago
We routinely hear stories about a "fat fingered" trader. While most of the trades remain irreversible, sometimes they can be rolled back too. What happens if there is a massive error (or even a hack) and the trades of say 1billion cannot be rolled back? The problem of immutability works both ways. Surely, DTCC could build a better solution, provide say better APIs (hmmm, startup idea if someone wants to take it up) to brokers so that the information is always up to date instead of relying on blockchain.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]

atomical 9y ago

Why wouldn't they use Ethereum?

subway 9y ago
It's more likely they would use their own private blockchain. (Something ethereumish, like JP Morgan's Quorum, or Hyperledger Fabric).
- atomical 9y ago
  I was trying to draw that point out. Sometimes news like this is used to pump crypto coins.
  - jjn2009 9y ago
    hyperledger fabric is not a 'coin'.
legolassexyman 9y ago
Ethereum's main selling point is it lets you issue illegal unregistered securities. Why would a real company want to associate with that? Also the lead developer is some kid who believes very much in moving fast and breaking things. This philosophy may work for a social network site but not for other people's money. How many terrible bugs have been discovered in Ethereums short history? Too many. Additionally the size of its blockchain has already passed Bitcoin. It's file size is growing so fast and will pose a serious technical problem.
- anilshanbhag 9y ago
  Ethereum's main selling point is it lets you issue illegal unregistered securities. => Well that is the whole point of being decentralized. Anyone can do anything allowed by EVM. Also the lead developer is some kid who believes very much in moving fast and breaking things. This philosophy may work for a social network site but not for other people's money. => Well they have improved significantly. There are 3 implementations - one each in cpp, go and py. There are multiple miner implementation. It is significantly more mature and many people involved. See https://github.com/ethereum/go-ethereum https://github.com/ethereum/go-ethereum for example. 'terrible bugs'? there was one terrible bug a long time ago Additionally the size of its blockchain has already passed Bitcoin. It's file size is growing so fast and will pose a serious technical problem. => Storage is not a problem. We get TB size drives now. Most people use online wallets. There are various pruning measures which reduce the size significantly. There are many proposals to handle scaling if it were to become bottleneck.
  - DennisP 9y ago
    Also a very popular implementation in Rust. https://parity.io/ https://parity.io/
- atomical 9y ago
  Bitcoin is used for drugs, prostitution, and gambling. That terrible bug was the DAO, but that's the nature of the blockchain and applies to Bitcoin as well. If you want rollbacks you use a centralized server.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]

bo1024 9y ago

> This is the main application for Bitcoin IMO: custody and trade settlement in securities. Could you explain what problem bitcoin (or blockchains in general) solve in this space, or what improvement they can bring?

closeparen 9y ago
You can't be trusted to self-certify what you own. Middlemen who are trusted to keep the records of who owns what charge fees for their services.
- bo1024 9y ago
  Wow, interesting, I had no idea something like that would be a problem. Still seems surprising to me that whoever creates the blockchain couldn't just maintain the data structure as a centralized trusted authority, e.g. if they are going to be the one paying out the bond later anyway.

thisisit 9y ago

We routinely hear stories about a "fat fingered" trader. While most of the trades remain irreversible, sometimes they can be rolled back too. What happens if there is a massive error (or even a hack) and the trades of say 1billion cannot be rolled back? The problem of immutability works both ways. Surely, DTCC could build a better solution, provide say better APIs (hmmm, startup idea if someone wants to take it up) to brokers so that the information is always up to date instead of relying on blockchain.

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]