4 ms·

I’d argue the root cause is more that Mozilla is willing to trade away privacy for developer convenience. Oh, not arguing that. Even with Google out of the pic

by gcp 9y ago

I’d argue the root cause is more that Mozilla is willing to trade away privacy for developer convenience. Oh, not arguing that. Even with Google out of the picture entirely, Telemetry is a nice example. But I'd argue it is needed to stay relevant as a browser. So it's not a good counterargument to Mozilla's decision here. You can see from the relevant bugs that GA vs Piwik and such were certainly considered, so people are definitely thinking about "maybe we shouldn't do that". In the case of GA, it ended up with required data silo-ing on Google's side. For some people that won't be enough.

kuschku 9y ago
> For --some people-- all firefox users that won't be enough. The only reason people use Firefox nowadays is because they don’t trust Google. The intersection between "Trusts Google not to abuse data they get access to" and "uses Firefox" is the empty set.
- gcp 9y ago
  Nah, as is evident by the amount of Firefox users that still have Google as their search engine. It's a false equivalence. There is a difference between trusting Google not to abuse data they legally guaranteed not to abuse (Firefox), versus, well, pretty much plainly saying your data will be used, and knowing that the product has many features which make the tracking more pervasive and invasive (Chrome, Google Accounts, etc). I'd love for Mozilla to not use any Google stuff at all, but I'd also love a pony.
  - kuschku 9y ago
    Maybe because Firefox ships Google as default?
- eridius 9y ago
  Speak for yourself. I fully expect Google to abuse any data they think they can get away with. But I also expect Google Legal to make sure that Google adheres to the contracts they sign, and in this case they have a contract with Mozilla that requires the GA data to be silo'd. While I'd feel better if Mozilla didn't use GA at all, I also understand why they do use it, and I'm not going to pillory them over it.

by gcp 9y ago

kuschku 9y ago

> For --some people-- all firefox users that won't be enough. The only reason people use Firefox nowadays is because they don’t trust Google. The intersection between "Trusts Google not to abuse data they get access to" and "uses Firefox" is the empty set.

gcp 9y ago
Nah, as is evident by the amount of Firefox users that still have Google as their search engine. It's a false equivalence. There is a difference between trusting Google not to abuse data they legally guaranteed not to abuse (Firefox), versus, well, pretty much plainly saying your data will be used, and knowing that the product has many features which make the tracking more pervasive and invasive (Chrome, Google Accounts, etc). I'd love for Mozilla to not use any Google stuff at all, but I'd also love a pony.
- kuschku 9y ago
  Maybe because Firefox ships Google as default?
eridius 9y ago
Speak for yourself. I fully expect Google to abuse any data they think they can get away with. But I also expect Google Legal to make sure that Google adheres to the contracts they sign, and in this case they have a contract with Mozilla that requires the GA data to be silo'd. While I'd feel better if Mozilla didn't use GA at all, I also understand why they do use it, and I'm not going to pillory them over it.