5 ms·

For me one very important aspect of Linux is that the OS is decoupled from any kind of "consumer experience". In other words nothing in the OS is ever asking me

For me one very important aspect of Linux is that the OS is decoupled from any kind of "consumer experience". In other words nothing in the OS is ever asking me: Who I am For Payment Information Would I like to see an Ad Do I need additional products or services So I appreciate that this is handy for some people, but to me it's like avocado ice-cream. A bad idea that tastes like crap.

xyzxyz998 9y ago
Wow, you haven't even tried the thing once clearly. Can you elaborate on what is it that is bad about WSL being on Windows? How does it make things bad for anybody? It's called choice.
- dm319 9y ago
  I think he is referring to the experience of using Windows 10 not WSL - they really do push for you to register/sign-in to an online account just to install creators update - even going so far as placing opt-outs in funny positions on the screen so it isn't obvious that is a possibility. Why does the start menu contain software that isn't installed and adverts? Why do you need an account to download free software from the store? There's certainly a line of argument that says you can have all the linux goodness without all of that.
- scandox 9y ago
  I have been in my day a very heavy user of Windows. What I object to on both Windows and Mac is the whole "store" experience. When my personal computer asks me for a credit card, I find this to be a profoundly uncomfortable experience - whether that's rational or not is a separate question. So that's why to me it's like Avocado Ice Cream: a choice many people are free to make and enjoy....like the maniacs they are.
  - asendra 9y ago
    The only time your mac ask for your credit card information is when you are trying to pay something with your Apple account and you don't already have it. If you don't want to be uncomfortable then simply don't try to pay for something with your Apple account.
    - falcolas 9y ago
      Not wholly true. My mac ecosystem is currently blocking the download of a free app until I verify my CC information (which consists of entering the CCV for the hundredth time, but that's a separate rant).
      - beerbaron23 9y ago
        Defiantly not totally true, I have multiple accounts on the mac store and I've never once been asked for a credit card, I download free apps via the store at will. If that bothers you, you can always just download the app from the dev's website and not bother with the store completely. What probably happened is that you have an existing expired CC on your account, so just remove it and continue on...
        falcolas 9y ago
        What is actually happening is my Apple account gets locked out about once a week (completely outside of my control), so they want me to verify everything again, even to make "free" purchases. A real PITA. > you can always just download the app from the dev's website and not bother with the store completely This makes a number of assumptions - namely that the developer has made the app available via their website (which is not common if they use in-app purchases).
    - scandox 9y ago
      Apple required/asked for Credit Card from me to upgrade a Desktop to (I think) Mavericks. It was an old computer that an employee of mine used to use. I logged in, had a look, saw an available upgrade and clicked to install it and - boom - please can we have your CC. I do not like that.
    - beagle3 9y ago
      It depends what store you are connected to, I think. Haven't had the experience on the Mac, but on the iPhone, it let me download things freely on the US store but required I provide a credit card before it let me download free stuff from another store.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
marmaduke 9y ago
I have a surface pro 4 but no account or cc info. I deactivated most of that stuff. WSL is cool, but frankly the built in hypervisor is better.
nol13 9y ago
I'll never understand how people are seemingly ok with ads from their OS.
- 43224gg252 9y ago
  I'll never understand why so-called "hackers" will defend Microsoft and their products when Microsoft participated in the NSA PRISM program in secret. This was a program most of congress didn't even know about, but execs at MS knew. They were knowingly violating your right to privacy and knew the government was doing it. Microsoft are bad guys. I won't even go into what all they did in the 90's under Bill Gates (https://archive.fo/CJ4PV https://archive.fo/CJ4PV). Not only that, but Windows is a crap OS. Anytime anyone defends Windows it always comes down to program compatibility and not OS quality. Linux for me is more stable, performant, doesn't slow down after a few months of use, has better choice in file system, has actual package management, doesn't force me to reboot for updates, doesn't take 8 hours to install .NET framework after rebooting preventing me from doing work, has great container technology, the list could just go on. Windows isn't a good OS, it just has games and office and a few "professional" programs that most "hackers" don't ever touch. It's filesystem is crap, it's update policy is crap and should have been fixed millennia ago, svchost is always a problem, font rendering is still worse then any other OS, ads in the os, spyware in the OS, closed source so you can't even really hack on it, etc. But it's got games so that makes it the best OS for software development? Any one who thinks this has never given Linux a serious shot. After programing and setting up development environments with proper package management and having a sane command line, using Windows for development, especially in multiple languages is a huge chore that usually involves lots of breakage over time. On Linux things feel much more cohesive. Even Microsoft agrees that Linux is better for developers, seeing as they implemented a Linux sub-system right into their OS. They've admitted defeat. They aren't even going to try to fix windows. Microsoft doesn't even care about Windows. People on HN care more about Windows than MS does.

xyzxyz998 9y ago

Wow, you haven't even tried the thing once clearly. Can you elaborate on what is it that is bad about WSL being on Windows? How does it make things bad for anybody? It's called choice.

dm319 9y ago
I think he is referring to the experience of using Windows 10 not WSL - they really do push for you to register/sign-in to an online account just to install creators update - even going so far as placing opt-outs in funny positions on the screen so it isn't obvious that is a possibility. Why does the start menu contain software that isn't installed and adverts? Why do you need an account to download free software from the store? There's certainly a line of argument that says you can have all the linux goodness without all of that.
scandox 9y ago
I have been in my day a very heavy user of Windows. What I object to on both Windows and Mac is the whole "store" experience. When my personal computer asks me for a credit card, I find this to be a profoundly uncomfortable experience - whether that's rational or not is a separate question. So that's why to me it's like Avocado Ice Cream: a choice many people are free to make and enjoy....like the maniacs they are.
- asendra 9y ago
  The only time your mac ask for your credit card information is when you are trying to pay something with your Apple account and you don't already have it. If you don't want to be uncomfortable then simply don't try to pay for something with your Apple account.
  - falcolas 9y ago
    Not wholly true. My mac ecosystem is currently blocking the download of a free app until I verify my CC information (which consists of entering the CCV for the hundredth time, but that's a separate rant).
    - beerbaron23 9y ago
      Defiantly not totally true, I have multiple accounts on the mac store and I've never once been asked for a credit card, I download free apps via the store at will. If that bothers you, you can always just download the app from the dev's website and not bother with the store completely. What probably happened is that you have an existing expired CC on your account, so just remove it and continue on...
      - falcolas 9y ago
        What is actually happening is my Apple account gets locked out about once a week (completely outside of my control), so they want me to verify everything again, even to make "free" purchases. A real PITA. > you can always just download the app from the dev's website and not bother with the store completely This makes a number of assumptions - namely that the developer has made the app available via their website (which is not common if they use in-app purchases).
  - scandox 9y ago
    Apple required/asked for Credit Card from me to upgrade a Desktop to (I think) Mavericks. It was an old computer that an employee of mine used to use. I logged in, had a look, saw an available upgrade and clicked to install it and - boom - please can we have your CC. I do not like that.
  - beagle3 9y ago
    It depends what store you are connected to, I think. Haven't had the experience on the Mac, but on the iPhone, it let me download things freely on the US store but required I provide a credit card before it let me download free stuff from another store.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]

marmaduke 9y ago

I have a surface pro 4 but no account or cc info. I deactivated most of that stuff. WSL is cool, but frankly the built in hypervisor is better.

nol13 9y ago

I'll never understand how people are seemingly ok with ads from their OS.

43224gg252 9y ago
I'll never understand why so-called "hackers" will defend Microsoft and their products when Microsoft participated in the NSA PRISM program in secret. This was a program most of congress didn't even know about, but execs at MS knew. They were knowingly violating your right to privacy and knew the government was doing it. Microsoft are bad guys. I won't even go into what all they did in the 90's under Bill Gates (https://archive.fo/CJ4PV https://archive.fo/CJ4PV). Not only that, but Windows is a crap OS. Anytime anyone defends Windows it always comes down to program compatibility and not OS quality. Linux for me is more stable, performant, doesn't slow down after a few months of use, has better choice in file system, has actual package management, doesn't force me to reboot for updates, doesn't take 8 hours to install .NET framework after rebooting preventing me from doing work, has great container technology, the list could just go on. Windows isn't a good OS, it just has games and office and a few "professional" programs that most "hackers" don't ever touch. It's filesystem is crap, it's update policy is crap and should have been fixed millennia ago, svchost is always a problem, font rendering is still worse then any other OS, ads in the os, spyware in the OS, closed source so you can't even really hack on it, etc. But it's got games so that makes it the best OS for software development? Any one who thinks this has never given Linux a serious shot. After programing and setting up development environments with proper package management and having a sane command line, using Windows for development, especially in multiple languages is a huge chore that usually involves lots of breakage over time. On Linux things feel much more cohesive. Even Microsoft agrees that Linux is better for developers, seeing as they implemented a Linux sub-system right into their OS. They've admitted defeat. They aren't even going to try to fix windows. Microsoft doesn't even care about Windows. People on HN care more about Windows than MS does.