3 ms·

Not to sound impolite at all, but your cover letter sounds more like a dating site profile than a cover letter for a job. Overly personal, a lot of irrelevant d

Not to sound impolite at all, but your cover letter sounds more like a dating site profile than a cover letter for a job. Overly personal, a lot of irrelevant details. Too friendly. Let your resume, portfolio, etc. do the talking.

smt88 9y ago
I totally disagree. The resume/portfolio will talk either way, but they usually don't say enough. If a cover letter can give me an idea of what it's like to talk to someone in real life, it helps tremendously. Resumes just blend together, and it becomes impossible to tell anyone apart. Doing anything -- literally anything -- that differentiates a resume from the rest of the stack is going to get me to pay more attention. Giving me a personal/emotional connection to the person and an idea of their personality is also going to help, because that's just how most human minds work. We tend to like people who put themselves out there.
- kostarelo 9y ago
  > Doing anything -- literally anything -- that differentiates a resume from the rest of the stack is going to get me to pay more attention. Giving me a personal/emotional connection to the person and an idea of their personality is also going to help, because that's just how most human minds work. We tend to like people who put themselves out there. Exactly. I know that there are a lot of better developers out there than me. I had to differentiate myself by introducing him in a more fun way just like I would do if I was meeting them in person.
- sotojuan 9y ago
  You stand out in a cover letter by finding a concise and convincing to summarize why they should interview you and the value you bring. Not by telling people your hobbies or how nice the beach near you is. That kind of stuff should come up naturally in a call or in person. The same applies to dating - putting so much info up front is rarely successful.
  - smt88 9y ago
    > You stand out in a cover letter by finding a concise and convincing to summarize why they should interview you and the value you bring You don't stand out that way because everyone else is writing the same thing. After the first five, it's monotonous and loses any feeling of meaning or sincerity. I usually know what "value" someone will bring by their resume. I need a data engineer -- you're a data engineer! Great. Business value is established. Beyond that, I'm trying to figure out what it's like to work with you, whether you're an ethical person, whether you can work independently, etc. Those things are conveyed by personal details (and, eventually, the interview).
    - sotojuan 9y ago
      > Beyond that, I'm trying to figure out what it's like to work with you, whether you're an ethical person, whether you can work independently, etc. Good point, you are right. I still believe what OP had in his cover letter was unnecessary but it would not be a deal breaker for me. Honestly, if he got rid of the paragraph about his hobbies and the sentence about where he lives, it's pretty good aside from some generic phrases ("I like clean code" - who doesn't?).
- nemetroid 9y ago
  I agree that differentiation is a good goal, but the issue here is that the letter comes across as trying to use a personal tone to compensate for technical acuity. The author even says so in a sibling comment: "I know that there are a lot of better developers out there than me.". Putting a personal twist on a letter focusing on the value you would bring to the company is a good thing, but the opposite does not work as well.
  - smt88 9y ago
    I still don't think that's a problem. Technical acuity, as you put it, isn't always the best measure of productivity, especially for those of us working on CRUD web apps. Once someone has demonstrated some level of ability, I care much more about how well they work with a team, how excited they are to learn, etc.
kostarelo 9y ago
No worries, I totally get your point. I've also got some good feedback, though, from some HR and that made me keep sending the same email.
danpalmer 9y ago
I'd agree with this, I read the the cover letter and found it unconvincing. Specific things I'd do to improve it are: - Make it less personal, the whole first paragraph is unnecessary, as is the 5th. Much of the blog paragraph could be removed. - Focus on the projects. - Add _far_ more about relevance to the company applying. I'm not sure how much was being added in the placeholder for company relevant information, but I'd expect roughly 50-70% of a cover letter to be company specific, explaining how your skills and experience will make you a good hire for the company. - I'd probably add a cultural question about the company - this invites a response, will be something a recruiter can answer easily, and will show that culture matters to you. - I'd probably play down the Node.js experience unless that's what the company specifically does - otherwise it reads like Node is the only major recent experience you have, which is unlikely to be useful at most companies.
- kostarelo 9y ago
  > - I'd probably add a cultural question about the company - this invites a response, will be something a recruiter can answer easily, and will show that culture matters to you. Hmmm, that's actually a great idea. A conversation starter. Thanks.
kostarelo 9y ago
Here's an actual reply: Good morning Kostas! I saw something this morning that showed Chalkidiki, I wish I could remember where I saw it - the water was so clear and blue it looks blissful! Thank you for taking the time to write to us, we are currently not hiring. But as a start up this could change in an instance. I will put your email into our database and should a match with your skill set arise we will reach out to you. I do want to let you know however, I am sorry to say, at the moment COMPANY_NAME lacks the legal resources to sponsor visas other than TN-1visas for Canadian and Mexican citizens. Warmly, Emily
- CydeWeys 9y ago
  99/100 people won't have been there or seen something about it recently, and so they won't connect over it. That section came off as cringey to me -- it screamed "poor culture fit with overly chummy foreigner who doesn't understand what job-hunting communications in the US look like" (no offense). You don't start off a job hunt by bragging up the beauty of your native land. It's just weird and irrelevant. What works to get my attention in the first paragraph of a cover letter would be any of the following: 1. Past employment at a well-known high quality employer (e.g. the Big 4). 2. Substantial contributions to important open source projects, ideally ones that I've heard about. 3. A history of high performance at previous employers, e.g. you've been promoted to tech lead and/or brought on at senior level. I don't care about your beaches.
  - kostarelo 9y ago
    Yes totally understandable! :) Thanks.
  - StavrosK 9y ago
    Are you saying that beaches ain't shit?

smt88 9y ago

I totally disagree. The resume/portfolio will talk either way, but they usually don't say enough. If a cover letter can give me an idea of what it's like to talk to someone in real life, it helps tremendously. Resumes just blend together, and it becomes impossible to tell anyone apart. Doing anything -- literally anything -- that differentiates a resume from the rest of the stack is going to get me to pay more attention. Giving me a personal/emotional connection to the person and an idea of their personality is also going to help, because that's just how most human minds work. We tend to like people who put themselves out there.

kostarelo 9y ago
> Doing anything -- literally anything -- that differentiates a resume from the rest of the stack is going to get me to pay more attention. Giving me a personal/emotional connection to the person and an idea of their personality is also going to help, because that's just how most human minds work. We tend to like people who put themselves out there. Exactly. I know that there are a lot of better developers out there than me. I had to differentiate myself by introducing him in a more fun way just like I would do if I was meeting them in person.
sotojuan 9y ago
You stand out in a cover letter by finding a concise and convincing to summarize why they should interview you and the value you bring. Not by telling people your hobbies or how nice the beach near you is. That kind of stuff should come up naturally in a call or in person. The same applies to dating - putting so much info up front is rarely successful.
- smt88 9y ago
  > You stand out in a cover letter by finding a concise and convincing to summarize why they should interview you and the value you bring You don't stand out that way because everyone else is writing the same thing. After the first five, it's monotonous and loses any feeling of meaning or sincerity. I usually know what "value" someone will bring by their resume. I need a data engineer -- you're a data engineer! Great. Business value is established. Beyond that, I'm trying to figure out what it's like to work with you, whether you're an ethical person, whether you can work independently, etc. Those things are conveyed by personal details (and, eventually, the interview).
  - sotojuan 9y ago
    > Beyond that, I'm trying to figure out what it's like to work with you, whether you're an ethical person, whether you can work independently, etc. Good point, you are right. I still believe what OP had in his cover letter was unnecessary but it would not be a deal breaker for me. Honestly, if he got rid of the paragraph about his hobbies and the sentence about where he lives, it's pretty good aside from some generic phrases ("I like clean code" - who doesn't?).
nemetroid 9y ago
I agree that differentiation is a good goal, but the issue here is that the letter comes across as trying to use a personal tone to compensate for technical acuity. The author even says so in a sibling comment: "I know that there are a lot of better developers out there than me.". Putting a personal twist on a letter focusing on the value you would bring to the company is a good thing, but the opposite does not work as well.
- smt88 9y ago
  I still don't think that's a problem. Technical acuity, as you put it, isn't always the best measure of productivity, especially for those of us working on CRUD web apps. Once someone has demonstrated some level of ability, I care much more about how well they work with a team, how excited they are to learn, etc.

kostarelo 9y ago

No worries, I totally get your point. I've also got some good feedback, though, from some HR and that made me keep sending the same email.

danpalmer 9y ago

I'd agree with this, I read the the cover letter and found it unconvincing. Specific things I'd do to improve it are: - Make it less personal, the whole first paragraph is unnecessary, as is the 5th. Much of the blog paragraph could be removed. - Focus on the projects. - Add _far_ more about relevance to the company applying. I'm not sure how much was being added in the placeholder for company relevant information, but I'd expect roughly 50-70% of a cover letter to be company specific, explaining how your skills and experience will make you a good hire for the company. - I'd probably add a cultural question about the company - this invites a response, will be something a recruiter can answer easily, and will show that culture matters to you. - I'd probably play down the Node.js experience unless that's what the company specifically does - otherwise it reads like Node is the only major recent experience you have, which is unlikely to be useful at most companies.

kostarelo 9y ago
> - I'd probably add a cultural question about the company - this invites a response, will be something a recruiter can answer easily, and will show that culture matters to you. Hmmm, that's actually a great idea. A conversation starter. Thanks.

kostarelo 9y ago

Here's an actual reply: Good morning Kostas! I saw something this morning that showed Chalkidiki, I wish I could remember where I saw it - the water was so clear and blue it looks blissful! Thank you for taking the time to write to us, we are currently not hiring. But as a start up this could change in an instance. I will put your email into our database and should a match with your skill set arise we will reach out to you. I do want to let you know however, I am sorry to say, at the moment COMPANY_NAME lacks the legal resources to sponsor visas other than TN-1visas for Canadian and Mexican citizens. Warmly, Emily

CydeWeys 9y ago
99/100 people won't have been there or seen something about it recently, and so they won't connect over it. That section came off as cringey to me -- it screamed "poor culture fit with overly chummy foreigner who doesn't understand what job-hunting communications in the US look like" (no offense). You don't start off a job hunt by bragging up the beauty of your native land. It's just weird and irrelevant. What works to get my attention in the first paragraph of a cover letter would be any of the following: 1. Past employment at a well-known high quality employer (e.g. the Big 4). 2. Substantial contributions to important open source projects, ideally ones that I've heard about. 3. A history of high performance at previous employers, e.g. you've been promoted to tech lead and/or brought on at senior level. I don't care about your beaches.
- kostarelo 9y ago
  Yes totally understandable! :) Thanks.
- StavrosK 9y ago
  Are you saying that beaches ain't shit?