30 ms·

We have a gen 1 technology that you strap on your face and you literally feel like you're somewhere else. You look down and see your hands; glance across the ta

by agar 9y ago

We have a gen 1 technology that you strap on your face and you literally feel like you're somewhere else. You look down and see your hands; glance across the table and see, and talk to, and interact with, another person that's really across the globe; you can build a world and inhabit it. And we're discussing when to call it a failure. On a site called Hacker News. OK. But that's kind of my point - people can be so focused on "calling failure" that they miss the incredibly transformative development that's right in front of them. Regarding a "timeline for calling failure" - who knows? Sometimes success comes to the sole believer who labors on long after everyone else abandoned hope. But how often in tech is something truly a failure? Was AI a failure in the 60's? It brought us LISP and defined the space. The 80's? It brought important foundational work to CNNs. The 90's? Would we be here without Deep Blue? Was mobile a failure with WAP? Palm? Newton? Was Internet 1.0 a failure when the bubble burst in 2000? All were important steps that got us to our ubiquitously interconnected, AI-enabled, device-driven present. So why the focus on identifying something as a failure, or tagging the moment that "they're not catching on"? How are you defining success? Adoption? If so, based on what metric - and at what ramp - and based on whose expectations? Investment success? For whom? Even if this generation of VR fails to gain traction, I truly believe it will be viewed as just one more step towards the inevitable. It's that good. But my point is that such failure will be due more to social issues than technical ones.

droopyEyelids 9y ago
Do you have any VR gear? How often would you honestly say you use it?
- escherize 9y ago
  Do you have a fliphone? How often would you honestly say you check the weather with it?
  - coldtea 9y ago
    Not really a counter-argument. Flip-flops had tons of adoption (literally billions of people used them) when they were the state of the art.
    - coldtea 9y ago
      Heh, flip-phones I meant... (although flip-flops also have a wide adoption)
- agar 9y ago
  I have a Rift, and use it two to three times a week. I would use it more, but I have very little discretionary time. I would say VR consumes about 50% to 75% of my free entertainment time. If the resolution was a bit higher, I would probably do a few hours of work per day in VR as well. I find I'm fairly focused when working in VR as I have no environmental distractions yet can be in very peaceful surroundings (Mars, space, a balcony overlooking city lights, etc.). I use an app called Big Screen to bring up my desktop in VR. Interestingly, it's multi-user so others could co-work in the same environment, look over my shoulder at my screen, talk, etc. even from across the world - if I had colleagues with an HMD and wanted to collaborate with them, of course (so much for the focus and serenity part of it!)
pandaman 9y ago
But this is not gen 1. Even HMDs we had in 90s were not gen 1. This tech is old. Gen 1 was in early 80s. We are on gen 5 now, probably. It has not taken off before, there is no reason to think it will take off now. We've got better graphics each gen but otherwise it's the same. Televisions had crappy graphics initially but people bought them nevertheless. Game consoles had crappy graphics but people bought them nevertheless. Digital cameras had crappy graphics but people bought them nevertheless. Do you think people did not buy VR before because of crappy graphics but are going to buy them now all of sudden or sometime in the future when graphics will be even better?
- gondo 9y ago
  it is not about the graphics, it is about the content
  - pandaman 9y ago
    Exactly. TVs, game consoles and digital cameras I mentioned were sold as devices to consume and produce content people wanted. The current VR push is "Look how awesome the technology is now! Surely somebody will make a lot of tasty content for it. Any time now. Why would not you buy a set so you are ready when the content hits? It's coming. Get your set now so you won't have to wait in lines when the content will finally appear and everyone will rush the stores. This will happen. Just be prepared. Any minute now."
    - saiya-jin 9y ago
      Sad, but so true. Where are the awesome games and apps for hardware released last year, when devs had years and years to produce content for them? Not toys for few minutes / hours at max, but proper, immersive long games designed specifically for VR. They are so far not here, and thus we, the majority wait. And let's be honest - having some fine action game in 4k on 65" TV ain't that bad experience either
    - ZenoArrow 9y ago
      If you get a chance to play SUPERHOT VR, do. It's the best VR game I've ever played. The only drawback is the cost of the rig needed to play it.
markatkinson 9y ago
This comment thread should be its own HN post.
- agar 9y ago
  I'm not sure what you mean. Is that a criticism or a compliment?

by agar 9y ago

droopyEyelids 9y ago

Do you have any VR gear? How often would you honestly say you use it?

escherize 9y ago
Do you have a fliphone? How often would you honestly say you check the weather with it?
- coldtea 9y ago
  Not really a counter-argument. Flip-flops had tons of adoption (literally billions of people used them) when they were the state of the art.
  - coldtea 9y ago
    Heh, flip-phones I meant... (although flip-flops also have a wide adoption)
agar 9y ago
I have a Rift, and use it two to three times a week. I would use it more, but I have very little discretionary time. I would say VR consumes about 50% to 75% of my free entertainment time. If the resolution was a bit higher, I would probably do a few hours of work per day in VR as well. I find I'm fairly focused when working in VR as I have no environmental distractions yet can be in very peaceful surroundings (Mars, space, a balcony overlooking city lights, etc.). I use an app called Big Screen to bring up my desktop in VR. Interestingly, it's multi-user so others could co-work in the same environment, look over my shoulder at my screen, talk, etc. even from across the world - if I had colleagues with an HMD and wanted to collaborate with them, of course (so much for the focus and serenity part of it!)

pandaman 9y ago

But this is not gen 1. Even HMDs we had in 90s were not gen 1. This tech is old. Gen 1 was in early 80s. We are on gen 5 now, probably. It has not taken off before, there is no reason to think it will take off now. We've got better graphics each gen but otherwise it's the same. Televisions had crappy graphics initially but people bought them nevertheless. Game consoles had crappy graphics but people bought them nevertheless. Digital cameras had crappy graphics but people bought them nevertheless. Do you think people did not buy VR before because of crappy graphics but are going to buy them now all of sudden or sometime in the future when graphics will be even better?

gondo 9y ago
it is not about the graphics, it is about the content
- pandaman 9y ago
  Exactly. TVs, game consoles and digital cameras I mentioned were sold as devices to consume and produce content people wanted. The current VR push is "Look how awesome the technology is now! Surely somebody will make a lot of tasty content for it. Any time now. Why would not you buy a set so you are ready when the content hits? It's coming. Get your set now so you won't have to wait in lines when the content will finally appear and everyone will rush the stores. This will happen. Just be prepared. Any minute now."
  - saiya-jin 9y ago
    Sad, but so true. Where are the awesome games and apps for hardware released last year, when devs had years and years to produce content for them? Not toys for few minutes / hours at max, but proper, immersive long games designed specifically for VR. They are so far not here, and thus we, the majority wait. And let's be honest - having some fine action game in 4k on 65" TV ain't that bad experience either
  - ZenoArrow 9y ago
    If you get a chance to play SUPERHOT VR, do. It's the best VR game I've ever played. The only drawback is the cost of the rig needed to play it.

markatkinson 9y ago

This comment thread should be its own HN post.

agar 9y ago
I'm not sure what you mean. Is that a criticism or a compliment?