4 ms·

Is there a date on this? This feels like a (1997) article at the latest.

jaclaz 9y ago
Maybe not 1997, but surely not "recent" (let alone "news") at least the Wayback Machine has it archived since Feb 8,2006: https://web.archive.org/web/*/http://warp.povusers.org/grrr/java.html https://web.archive.org/web/*/http://warp.povusers.org/grrr/...
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
foota 9y ago
It predates generics at least.
- Retric 9y ago
  Generics don't solve the TypeDef problem. It's the old, I am probably never going to need anything over 2 billion, but I am not 100% sure.
  - AstralStorm 9y ago
    Generic method syntax is both much more limited and more complex... Foo<? super Bar extends Madness> with various insane limitations. Makes C++ SFINAE seem elegant...
  - foota 9y ago
    I was talking about the following: "Now, in Java, if you use a data container provided by the language, you are forced to upcast all the time." Which is solved by generics.
    - Retric 9y ago
      Last I checked, if you store an int in a generic it get's converted to an object which takes more memory to store. So, the syntax is similar, but the actual behavior is not because int's can't be null, but Integers can for example. This costs 8 ish bytes of memory.
      - foota 9y ago
        That is true. It looks like there is some work being done to potentially relax this constraint, http://openjdk.java.net/jeps/218 http://openjdk.java.net/jeps/218
- zokier 9y ago
  And according to Wikipedia generics were added to Java in 2004, so that gives some baseline. JSR14 was for introducing generics, and it was initiated in 1999. That leaves 5 year window during which the article was most likely written.
  - khedoros1 9y ago
    > And according to Wikipedia generics were added to Java in 2004 I was in college around that time, using Java as a language for coursework. The professors jumped on generics right away, so between two quarters, the style that we wrote our Java in shifted drastically. I was nice to rip the band-aid off that fast.
nayuki 9y ago
The index page has dates for other articles, but not this one. http://warp.povusers.org/grrr/index.html http://warp.povusers.org/grrr/index.html Archive.org's first snapshot of this page is on 2006-02-08. The HTTP response headers contain the entry: "Last-Modified: Sun, 14 Oct 2012 08:58:12 GMT"
CalChris 9y ago
Archive.org says 2006. https://web.archive.org/web/20060208015310/http://warp.povusers.org/grrr/java.html https://web.archive.org/web/20060208015310/http://warp.povus...

Maybe not 1997, but surely not "recent" (let alone "news") at least the Wayback Machine has it archived since Feb 8,2006: https://web.archive.org/web/*/http://warp.povusers.org/grrr/java.html https://web.archive.org/web/*/http://warp.povusers.org/grrr/...

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

foota 9y ago

It predates generics at least.

Retric 9y ago
Generics don't solve the TypeDef problem. It's the old, I am probably never going to need anything over 2 billion, but I am not 100% sure.
- AstralStorm 9y ago
  Generic method syntax is both much more limited and more complex... Foo<? super Bar extends Madness> with various insane limitations. Makes C++ SFINAE seem elegant...
- foota 9y ago
  I was talking about the following: "Now, in Java, if you use a data container provided by the language, you are forced to upcast all the time." Which is solved by generics.
  - Retric 9y ago
    Last I checked, if you store an int in a generic it get's converted to an object which takes more memory to store. So, the syntax is similar, but the actual behavior is not because int's can't be null, but Integers can for example. This costs 8 ish bytes of memory.
    - foota 9y ago
      That is true. It looks like there is some work being done to potentially relax this constraint, http://openjdk.java.net/jeps/218 http://openjdk.java.net/jeps/218
zokier 9y ago
And according to Wikipedia generics were added to Java in 2004, so that gives some baseline. JSR14 was for introducing generics, and it was initiated in 1999. That leaves 5 year window during which the article was most likely written.
- khedoros1 9y ago
  > And according to Wikipedia generics were added to Java in 2004 I was in college around that time, using Java as a language for coursework. The professors jumped on generics right away, so between two quarters, the style that we wrote our Java in shifted drastically. I was nice to rip the band-aid off that fast.

nayuki 9y ago

The index page has dates for other articles, but not this one. http://warp.povusers.org/grrr/index.html http://warp.povusers.org/grrr/index.html Archive.org's first snapshot of this page is on 2006-02-08. The HTTP response headers contain the entry: "Last-Modified: Sun, 14 Oct 2012 08:58:12 GMT"

CalChris 9y ago

Archive.org says 2006. https://web.archive.org/web/20060208015310/http://warp.povusers.org/grrr/java.html https://web.archive.org/web/20060208015310/http://warp.povus...