7 ms·

I keep seeing these projects to make wordpress work more like a cms and I keep thinking why not just use a cms?

by dangerface 9y ago

austinpray 9y ago
WordPress is a cms first and foremost. edit: lol today I learned cms != blog
- tyingq 9y ago
  I'd say "sort of". It does support custom field types and custom post types. But you have to either write code, or use some 3rd party plugin to manage/use them.
- bybjorn 9y ago
  Why do you then still get a blog when you install it?
  - hobofan 9y ago
    Legacy behavior nobody bothered to update ;)
- zaphar 9y ago
  No. WordPress is a blogging platform. A CMS is much more than that. If you need a CMS you probably want something more than WordPress.
  - SippinLean 9y ago
    Have you used it recently? What you say was true 10 years ago, but what features does it lack compared to a "true" CMS today? I've built several high-traffic e-commerce sites using it, none of them had a blog. Compared to something like Drupal it's a total pleasure to use.
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
    - mrkrab 9y ago
      That's like saying WordPress is a forum because you can install bbPress.
      - SippinLean 9y ago
        That's like saying WordPress is a great CMS to manage the content for your forum, using a plethora of great plugins or custom post types to output the content in a forum-like view.
    - marpstar 9y ago
      Same here, I built and oversee 3 WordPress online stores that together do more than $1m/month during peak season (summer). WordPress has the ability for pages as well as posts (along with versioning of those items). User account management with permissions. Custom fields. What exactly does "true CMS" mean? And I'd argue the easiest-to-use admin area out there, or so my clients lead me to believe.
      - dangerface 9y ago
        I have moved wordpress stores to other e-commerce platforms and seen an instant improvement in sales. Thats why wordpress is a blog and not a CMS because the only content it handles well are blog posts and basic wall of text pages. A CMS will not limit or put a definition on the content it manages, thats up to you. As an example, how complicated would it be to model the content of a store, store manager and then the relation ships between them, this is basic stuff for any other CMS. If you don't show your clients anything else they will think its great. My clients say the same thing about wordpress, until they see something else then they wonder why anyone uses wordpress.
        SippinLean 9y ago
        >to other e-commerce platforms Which platforms? What was different about them that made them better than WP? >because the only content it handles well are blog posts and basic wall of text pages Unless you use post types. Now since 4.7 post types can apply to everything, including page templates. Have you tried using this and failed before you made your comment?
  - paulcole 9y ago
    >A CMS is much more than that. Can you explain?
- dangerface 9y ago
  wordpress.org says its a blog in the title, it's the first word.
  - claudiulodro 9y ago
    Haha and what's the last word? "Blog Tool, Publishing Platform, and CMS" WordPress is a flexible, multipurpose software platform.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
uzegonemad 9y ago
What's your recommendation for an open-source CMS? Preferably one with relatively simple administration that a layman (client) could still comprehend. cc @tyingq, @zaphar, @bybjorn, @dangerface
- SephoD 9y ago
  Wagtail (www.wagtail.io) all the way. We at Overcast use this for all our clients, ranging from small sites with a couple of pages to enterprise sites with thousands of pages. Very simple but very powerful admin interface and treads the line very nicely between simplicity for programmer vs simplicity for the end user.
- lancekey 9y ago
  I like Craft CMS[0]. It's very flexible and developer friendly. Great for custom site builds. [0]: https://craftcms.com/ https://craftcms.com/
  - lj3 9y ago
    Does it support multisite? Multisite is a big reason for wordpress's popularity as a CMS.
    - lancekey 9y ago
      Coming to Craft 3 - https://craftcms.com/news/craft-3-multi-site https://craftcms.com/news/craft-3-multi-site
- thousande 9y ago
  If Java is not a hurdle, checkout Enonic CMS, http://enonic.com/ http://enonic.com/ Edit: * Java on the back-end
- dangerface 9y ago
  Good question. I like perch its quick and easy to build with, I moved from wordpress to perch last year and it has cut development time in half. It's super flexible no need for dodgy third part plugins that's no longer maintained. Instead of plugins I just build everything I need custom with the tools perch provides, I end up with something thats perfect for the client and its a lot faster than trying to modify some third party plugin. Clients are initially scared of perch, they want wordpress because thats what they are used to and "thats what every one else uses". Five minutes into their perch training their attitude is "This is great. Why does every one else use wordpress?". Sure its not free like wordpress but its only £50 and its worth every penny, you will easily make that money back in development costs in a day. https://grabaperch.com/ https://grabaperch.com/
garethsprice 9y ago
It's simple, non-tech admin staff are familiar with the interface (and can be easily trained), there's a vast ecosystem of plugins and integrations for it, it's easy to hire people or teams who have experience working with it. WP has its flaws and an upper limit to what it's capable of, but it's often a very pragmatic choice for small to medium sized content-driven websites.
- lj3 9y ago
  I hear this a lot, but I've found it to be untrue. When I used to do wordpress development, a large part of my job was to customize admin pages so the non-tech staff could actually use it. The default wordpress admin interface leaves a lot to be desired.
  - jameskanestl 9y ago
    Sure, but the admin customizations are pretty damn simple once you figure out the few commands you need (registering custom post types, adding & customizing options pages, removing unnecessary tabs per user role, etc). The fact is, it has the market share, so neophytes are at least somewhat familiar with the interface. That is a true advantage. Also, ACF Pro is your best friend in the CMS customization area & it easily dumps custom fields into the WP REST API for use in app frontends like ngx or React. I'm working on an app & CMS with this stack now and frankly, it's fantastic.
    - dangerface 9y ago
      (registering custom post types, adding & customizing options pages, removing unnecessary tabs per user role, etc) Thats my point you don't need to do any of that with a CMS it just works out of the box. People may be familiar with the admin interface but that doesn't mean its good, just that they havent seen anything better, if the admin interface is as good as something like perch you wont have to train the clients (we do anyway) its all just intuitive. I cant reply to your other comment but I do still have to work with wordpress and I also use ACF Pro, it sucks so many plugins made by third party developers who have went bust and left me to maintain their garbage code. As for alternatives I use and recomend https://grabaperch.com/ https://grabaperch.com/

I keep seeing these projects to make wordpress work more like a cms and I keep thinking why not just use a cms?

austinpray 9y ago

WordPress is a cms first and foremost. edit: lol today I learned cms != blog

tyingq 9y ago
I'd say "sort of". It does support custom field types and custom post types. But you have to either write code, or use some 3rd party plugin to manage/use them.
bybjorn 9y ago
Why do you then still get a blog when you install it?
- hobofan 9y ago
  Legacy behavior nobody bothered to update ;)
zaphar 9y ago
No. WordPress is a blogging platform. A CMS is much more than that. If you need a CMS you probably want something more than WordPress.
- SippinLean 9y ago
  Have you used it recently? What you say was true 10 years ago, but what features does it lack compared to a "true" CMS today? I've built several high-traffic e-commerce sites using it, none of them had a blog. Compared to something like Drupal it's a total pleasure to use.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - mrkrab 9y ago
    That's like saying WordPress is a forum because you can install bbPress.
    - SippinLean 9y ago
      That's like saying WordPress is a great CMS to manage the content for your forum, using a plethora of great plugins or custom post types to output the content in a forum-like view.
  - marpstar 9y ago
    Same here, I built and oversee 3 WordPress online stores that together do more than $1m/month during peak season (summer). WordPress has the ability for pages as well as posts (along with versioning of those items). User account management with permissions. Custom fields. What exactly does "true CMS" mean? And I'd argue the easiest-to-use admin area out there, or so my clients lead me to believe.
    - dangerface 9y ago
      I have moved wordpress stores to other e-commerce platforms and seen an instant improvement in sales. Thats why wordpress is a blog and not a CMS because the only content it handles well are blog posts and basic wall of text pages. A CMS will not limit or put a definition on the content it manages, thats up to you. As an example, how complicated would it be to model the content of a store, store manager and then the relation ships between them, this is basic stuff for any other CMS. If you don't show your clients anything else they will think its great. My clients say the same thing about wordpress, until they see something else then they wonder why anyone uses wordpress.
      - SippinLean 9y ago
        >to other e-commerce platforms Which platforms? What was different about them that made them better than WP? >because the only content it handles well are blog posts and basic wall of text pages Unless you use post types. Now since 4.7 post types can apply to everything, including page templates. Have you tried using this and failed before you made your comment?
- paulcole 9y ago
  >A CMS is much more than that. Can you explain?
dangerface 9y ago
wordpress.org says its a blog in the title, it's the first word.
- claudiulodro 9y ago
  Haha and what's the last word? "Blog Tool, Publishing Platform, and CMS" WordPress is a flexible, multipurpose software platform.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

uzegonemad 9y ago

What's your recommendation for an open-source CMS? Preferably one with relatively simple administration that a layman (client) could still comprehend. cc @tyingq, @zaphar, @bybjorn, @dangerface

SephoD 9y ago
Wagtail (www.wagtail.io) all the way. We at Overcast use this for all our clients, ranging from small sites with a couple of pages to enterprise sites with thousands of pages. Very simple but very powerful admin interface and treads the line very nicely between simplicity for programmer vs simplicity for the end user.
lancekey 9y ago
I like Craft CMS[0]. It's very flexible and developer friendly. Great for custom site builds. [0]: https://craftcms.com/ https://craftcms.com/
- lj3 9y ago
  Does it support multisite? Multisite is a big reason for wordpress's popularity as a CMS.
  - lancekey 9y ago
    Coming to Craft 3 - https://craftcms.com/news/craft-3-multi-site https://craftcms.com/news/craft-3-multi-site
thousande 9y ago
If Java is not a hurdle, checkout Enonic CMS, http://enonic.com/ http://enonic.com/ Edit: * Java on the back-end
dangerface 9y ago
Good question. I like perch its quick and easy to build with, I moved from wordpress to perch last year and it has cut development time in half. It's super flexible no need for dodgy third part plugins that's no longer maintained. Instead of plugins I just build everything I need custom with the tools perch provides, I end up with something thats perfect for the client and its a lot faster than trying to modify some third party plugin. Clients are initially scared of perch, they want wordpress because thats what they are used to and "thats what every one else uses". Five minutes into their perch training their attitude is "This is great. Why does every one else use wordpress?". Sure its not free like wordpress but its only £50 and its worth every penny, you will easily make that money back in development costs in a day. https://grabaperch.com/ https://grabaperch.com/

garethsprice 9y ago

It's simple, non-tech admin staff are familiar with the interface (and can be easily trained), there's a vast ecosystem of plugins and integrations for it, it's easy to hire people or teams who have experience working with it. WP has its flaws and an upper limit to what it's capable of, but it's often a very pragmatic choice for small to medium sized content-driven websites.

lj3 9y ago
I hear this a lot, but I've found it to be untrue. When I used to do wordpress development, a large part of my job was to customize admin pages so the non-tech staff could actually use it. The default wordpress admin interface leaves a lot to be desired.
- jameskanestl 9y ago
  Sure, but the admin customizations are pretty damn simple once you figure out the few commands you need (registering custom post types, adding & customizing options pages, removing unnecessary tabs per user role, etc). The fact is, it has the market share, so neophytes are at least somewhat familiar with the interface. That is a true advantage. Also, ACF Pro is your best friend in the CMS customization area & it easily dumps custom fields into the WP REST API for use in app frontends like ngx or React. I'm working on an app & CMS with this stack now and frankly, it's fantastic.
  - dangerface 9y ago
    (registering custom post types, adding & customizing options pages, removing unnecessary tabs per user role, etc) Thats my point you don't need to do any of that with a CMS it just works out of the box. People may be familiar with the admin interface but that doesn't mean its good, just that they havent seen anything better, if the admin interface is as good as something like perch you wont have to train the clients (we do anyway) its all just intuitive. I cant reply to your other comment but I do still have to work with wordpress and I also use ACF Pro, it sucks so many plugins made by third party developers who have went bust and left me to maintain their garbage code. As for alternatives I use and recomend https://grabaperch.com/ https://grabaperch.com/