5 ms·

Why MailChimp Doesn’t Let New Hires Work for Their First Week on the Job

13 points by dpflan 9y ago

toomuchtodo 9y ago
This is ridiculously refreshing compared to the posts I see where you're committing and pushing code to prod on your first day. Kudos Mailchimp! EDIT: Lots of sibling posts raining on their parade; if you're not interested in the culture and business as a whole, maybe consult instead?
- Denzel 9y ago
  Haha the sibling posts don't understand what company architecture is. Like software architecture, it's a skill unto itself. What Mailchimp is doing is fantastic. Disclosure: I've never been affiliated with Mailchimp. I just think more companies need to refocus on onboarding and training instead of complaining of a talent shortage. It's a market opportunity people!
- moonka 9y ago
  Outside the personality test which would weird me out a little, seems like something I'd love to have as my first week. I can figure out the code side of work on my own, but getting a leg up in figuring out who I'm working with and how everyone interacts would be so helpful!
- technion 9y ago
  I think that can be aimed at solving a different problem to the one superficially described. I've seen places that take 4-5 weeks for a sysadmin to assist a developer through how to get a development environment going. That is to say, I've been a sysadmin in a place that chose that approach. Putting the work in with containers or vagrant and a reasonable CI and workflow that just lets people get in front of the codebase and change something is an incredible Godsend and I hope to always have that approach in future. Whether someone actually pushes a fix for something that day should be a side issue.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
caleblloyd 9y ago
If a new hire isn't into hand holding and kumbaya, do they have an option to skip straight to getting real work done?
- Denzel 9y ago
  I think it'd be better for them to find another place to work. Not every employer-employee relationship is meant to be. Mailchimp believes onboarding is company-critical. And their turnover rate speaks for itself. There are plenty of other places to work.
  - db48x 9y ago
    But is the turnover rate caused by making all new employees sit through a week of inane meetings? Their turnover rate sounds amazing so they're obviously doing something right, but its hard to see how this would account for it.
    - Denzel 9y ago
      What's "inane" (defined as: silly, stupid) about these meetings? Be specific, because I'm curious.
      - db48x 9y ago
        scavenger hunt (around the office—just for fun!)
        deleted 9y ago
        [deleted]
mc32 9y ago
Is, this that revolutionary? I'm pretty sure a few companies out there in tech give you a week or two of training before you get any assignments?
- Denzel 9y ago
  Yes, it really is special. As you said, a few companies in tech do it. And they have a tremendous advantage. My overwhelming experience at companies ranging from small $1-5MM revenue shops to >$100MM startups has shown onboarding to be an ad-hoc afterthought. No conscious design. Many of these companies don't understand how much it's hurting them. As I've grown more senior, I've learned to onboard myself... seeking out knowledgeable individuals and teasing out the big picture. This is not the default for more junior developers. And thus they lag like an unspun turbo, whining as they try to spin up. To have full-spectrum -- internal- and external-faced -- onboarding baked into the company culture is a tremendous advantage. It promotes a clear, razor-sharp, global context that allows individuals to move faster with greater alignment. I love what MailChimp is doing.
  - db48x 9y ago
    You're not wrong, but a well-designed process for welcoming new employees to the company doesn't have to be a dog-and-pony show, or a week of meetings, or a nightmare specifically designed to torture introverts.
    - Denzel 9y ago
      I'm open to hearing detailed alternatives. Company architecture -- specifically, ensuring autonomous strategic alignment while minimizing synchronous communication -- is close to my heart. It'd be especially helpful to hear how to do this is in a way that's comfortable and welcoming to someone like you.
      - db48x 9y ago
        Most of the things listed in the schedule shown in the article would be better off as a wiki page. They've got a whole one-hour meeting for "Learn[ing] about parking and transportation options". This is information that cannot possibly change frequently, which not everyone will care about, and which you absolutely do not need to give a presentation about, and a wiki page is perfectly suited for communicating this information.
db48x 9y ago
Sounds like a dreadful place to work. You have to meet a bunch of people from over a dozen different departments, who you'll never talk to again? Meaningless mottoes and personality tests? A scavenger hunt?! All that crap before you even touch a computer? Count me out. The information I need to start a job can be written on one side of a single sheet of paper.
- beckler 9y ago
  I don't know, I know about four people who work there, and I'm sure they will never leave MailChimp. They absolutely love it. In Atlanta, MailChimp is where everyone wants to work, but it's hard to get in unless you're seriously great at what you do.
- mjmasn 9y ago
  Just on your personality test point, the Birkman Assessment mentioned in the article is absolutely the pinnacle of personality assessment. It's not like the meaningless toy tests like MBTI/Hogan/16pf you may have experienced before. It covers the usual motivation and behaviour pieces but it is unique in surfacing the underlying needs and stress reactions which often have no correlation to your visible 'normal' behaviour that other people see. Really helpful in determining your approach to different members of the team as well as giving you the common language to explain your needs to other people. In short it's both insightful and actionable for you and your team members in your personal and professional life. Plus it's stable over time, so you take the assessment once and have 20+ years of value from it. Disclaimer: I work for a company that uses the Birkman Assessment but no relation to MailChimp other than as a user of their newsletter services.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
OpenDrapery 9y ago
Kudos to the company for taking onboarding seriously. Most places are abysmal at it. But then again, I've recently been working at places that leverage a lot of contractors/consultants to get work done. The attitude seems to be, "why bother giving them context? They are just here to labor and then be gone."

13 points by dpflan 9y ago

This is ridiculously refreshing compared to the posts I see where you're committing and pushing code to prod on your first day. Kudos Mailchimp! EDIT: Lots of sibling posts raining on their parade; if you're not interested in the culture and business as a whole, maybe consult instead?

Denzel 9y ago
Haha the sibling posts don't understand what company architecture is. Like software architecture, it's a skill unto itself. What Mailchimp is doing is fantastic. Disclosure: I've never been affiliated with Mailchimp. I just think more companies need to refocus on onboarding and training instead of complaining of a talent shortage. It's a market opportunity people!
moonka 9y ago
Outside the personality test which would weird me out a little, seems like something I'd love to have as my first week. I can figure out the code side of work on my own, but getting a leg up in figuring out who I'm working with and how everyone interacts would be so helpful!
technion 9y ago
I think that can be aimed at solving a different problem to the one superficially described. I've seen places that take 4-5 weeks for a sysadmin to assist a developer through how to get a development environment going. That is to say, I've been a sysadmin in a place that chose that approach. Putting the work in with containers or vagrant and a reasonable CI and workflow that just lets people get in front of the codebase and change something is an incredible Godsend and I hope to always have that approach in future. Whether someone actually pushes a fix for something that day should be a side issue.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]

caleblloyd 9y ago

If a new hire isn't into hand holding and kumbaya, do they have an option to skip straight to getting real work done?

Denzel 9y ago
I think it'd be better for them to find another place to work. Not every employer-employee relationship is meant to be. Mailchimp believes onboarding is company-critical. And their turnover rate speaks for itself. There are plenty of other places to work.
- db48x 9y ago
  But is the turnover rate caused by making all new employees sit through a week of inane meetings? Their turnover rate sounds amazing so they're obviously doing something right, but its hard to see how this would account for it.
  - Denzel 9y ago
    What's "inane" (defined as: silly, stupid) about these meetings? Be specific, because I'm curious.
    - db48x 9y ago
      scavenger hunt (around the office—just for fun!)
      - deleted 9y ago
        [deleted]

mc32 9y ago

Is, this that revolutionary? I'm pretty sure a few companies out there in tech give you a week or two of training before you get any assignments?

Denzel 9y ago
Yes, it really is special. As you said, a few companies in tech do it. And they have a tremendous advantage. My overwhelming experience at companies ranging from small $1-5MM revenue shops to >$100MM startups has shown onboarding to be an ad-hoc afterthought. No conscious design. Many of these companies don't understand how much it's hurting them. As I've grown more senior, I've learned to onboard myself... seeking out knowledgeable individuals and teasing out the big picture. This is not the default for more junior developers. And thus they lag like an unspun turbo, whining as they try to spin up. To have full-spectrum -- internal- and external-faced -- onboarding baked into the company culture is a tremendous advantage. It promotes a clear, razor-sharp, global context that allows individuals to move faster with greater alignment. I love what MailChimp is doing.
- db48x 9y ago
  You're not wrong, but a well-designed process for welcoming new employees to the company doesn't have to be a dog-and-pony show, or a week of meetings, or a nightmare specifically designed to torture introverts.
  - Denzel 9y ago
    I'm open to hearing detailed alternatives. Company architecture -- specifically, ensuring autonomous strategic alignment while minimizing synchronous communication -- is close to my heart. It'd be especially helpful to hear how to do this is in a way that's comfortable and welcoming to someone like you.
    - db48x 9y ago
      Most of the things listed in the schedule shown in the article would be better off as a wiki page. They've got a whole one-hour meeting for "Learn[ing] about parking and transportation options". This is information that cannot possibly change frequently, which not everyone will care about, and which you absolutely do not need to give a presentation about, and a wiki page is perfectly suited for communicating this information.

db48x 9y ago

Sounds like a dreadful place to work. You have to meet a bunch of people from over a dozen different departments, who you'll never talk to again? Meaningless mottoes and personality tests? A scavenger hunt?! All that crap before you even touch a computer? Count me out. The information I need to start a job can be written on one side of a single sheet of paper.

beckler 9y ago
I don't know, I know about four people who work there, and I'm sure they will never leave MailChimp. They absolutely love it. In Atlanta, MailChimp is where everyone wants to work, but it's hard to get in unless you're seriously great at what you do.
mjmasn 9y ago
Just on your personality test point, the Birkman Assessment mentioned in the article is absolutely the pinnacle of personality assessment. It's not like the meaningless toy tests like MBTI/Hogan/16pf you may have experienced before. It covers the usual motivation and behaviour pieces but it is unique in surfacing the underlying needs and stress reactions which often have no correlation to your visible 'normal' behaviour that other people see. Really helpful in determining your approach to different members of the team as well as giving you the common language to explain your needs to other people. In short it's both insightful and actionable for you and your team members in your personal and professional life. Plus it's stable over time, so you take the assessment once and have 20+ years of value from it. Disclaimer: I work for a company that uses the Birkman Assessment but no relation to MailChimp other than as a user of their newsletter services.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

OpenDrapery 9y ago

Kudos to the company for taking onboarding seriously. Most places are abysmal at it. But then again, I've recently been working at places that leverage a lot of contractors/consultants to get work done. The attitude seems to be, "why bother giving them context? They are just here to labor and then be gone."