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Because (personal opinion) the Tesla Model S isn't a particularly great car. Their success is largely in marketing, network, and visual appeal, not in the produ

Because (personal opinion) the Tesla Model S isn't a particularly great car. Their success is largely in marketing, network, and visual appeal, not in the product itself. If you pick a better (albeit less appealing) electric car, the reliability rate skyrockets. For instance, using your own source -- https://www.truedelta.com/Nissan-LEAF-vs-Tesla-Model-S-reliability-comparison,968-1095 https://www.truedelta.com/Nissan-LEAF-vs-Tesla-Model-S-relia...

FussyZeus 9y ago
^ This. The Model S has a lot more in common with a mid-high range Mercedes or a low end Ferrari. Anybody who owns an exotic car like that will tell you, you do not buy those for the reliability. It's also worth noting the Model S is, and is marketed to the audience for, a performance car. When you put down that kind of money, you're going to drive it like one. If you drove a Honda like a Ferrari you'd likely break a whole lot of it's "reliable" parts too.
- chronic6a5 9y ago
  > If you drove a Honda like a Ferrari you'd likely break a whole lot of it's "reliable" parts too. You really need to stop drinking the Tesla kool-aid. Of course people drive Honda's like Ferraris. And guess what, the Honda's don't break as easily as the Teslas.
  - yellowapple 9y ago
    My own observations of Honda vehicles suggest differently, but I have very few observations of Tesla vehicles, so I don't really have enough of a point of comparison to really disagree with that assertion.
  - FussyZeus 9y ago
    I'm not drinking anybody's kool-aid. If you think a 691 bhp Tesla is going to wear it's parts the same way as a 278 bhp Accord, I have no words for you. That's not even taking into account the much higher acceleration forces, G-forces, etc. that the parts in a Tesla are going to be dealing with, plus the fact that it has a completely different center of gravity and that affects how every component of the suspension wears. I'm not saying Tesla build quality is higher or lower, I'm saying it's comparing apples and oranges. Once Tesla has a production everyman's car available, then you can actually say something. I know five people who own Model S's and they do not drive them like Accords, and if their stories are anything to go by, most people who own them drive them like performance cars. That means hard corners, rapid acceleration and deceleration, and high speeds (and given the crap quality of our roads around here, a lot of turbulence too). It's also worth noting that Honda's have decades upon decades of previous models to build off of. Tesla's been around since what, 2003? And they didn't have a car to show until 2008.
    - dpark 9y ago
      > If you think a 691 bhp Tesla is going to wear it's parts the same way as a 278 bhp Accord... Literally no one said that. And that wasn't the criticism of your comment. The criticism was that you asserted that Hondas would be as reliable as Ferraris if they were driven hard. Lots of people do drive their Hondas hard. They replace the exhaust and lower the car and maybe throw on a wing and pretend they're on a track all the time. They drive these things hard as hell and they hold up very well. > I'm not saying Tesla build quality is higher or lower, I'm saying it's comparing apples and oranges. It's not apples and oranges. It's cars and cars. Yes, people drive their Teslas harder than their Nissan Leafs. What about M5s? How do Teslas compare? They should be far more reliable due to the vastly simpler drivetrain. Are they? > It's also worth noting that Honda's have decades upon decades of previous models to build off of. Tesla's been around since what, 2003? And they didn't have a car to show until 2008. So your argument about Tesla reliability is essentially that they are unreliable, because they're new?
- dom0 9y ago
  A Mercedes limousine is hardly exotic, and neither is it unreliable.
jbmorgado 9y ago
What I found the most interesting in that comparison is that the Tesla, although having a lot more problems in other areas, had 0% issues in brakes and suspension. Are they using some different much more advanced technology for those parts, or it's just some problem with the repair data?
- jdcarr 9y ago
  I can only speak for the brakes. Teslas use regenerative braking on the motor before falling back to traditional frictional brake pads as I understand it. Essentially the motor is put in reverse and that drains off speed. That means less wear on the brakes and so they last much, much longer than an ICE car.
  - vkou 9y ago
    ICE hybrids use regenerative breaking.
  - woobar 9y ago
    My ICE car has regenerative braking. So this is not something exclusive to the EVs.
    - eggnet 9y ago
      Regenerative braking only works if there is spare battery capacity to absorb the energy. In general that requires a large battery to be useful. A normal car battery is nowhere near large enough and is generally topped off by the alternator. My ICE car has regenerative braking as well, but I certainly didn't buy it for that, nor have I been able to discern the impact of it. I have driven EVs before and the regenerative braking is unmistakable.
    - more_corn 9y ago
      Really? Don't you need a big electric motor for that... and some substantial lithium ion batteries? Is your ICE car a hybrid?

FussyZeus 9y ago

^ This. The Model S has a lot more in common with a mid-high range Mercedes or a low end Ferrari. Anybody who owns an exotic car like that will tell you, you do not buy those for the reliability. It's also worth noting the Model S is, and is marketed to the audience for, a performance car. When you put down that kind of money, you're going to drive it like one. If you drove a Honda like a Ferrari you'd likely break a whole lot of it's "reliable" parts too.

chronic6a5 9y ago
> If you drove a Honda like a Ferrari you'd likely break a whole lot of it's "reliable" parts too. You really need to stop drinking the Tesla kool-aid. Of course people drive Honda's like Ferraris. And guess what, the Honda's don't break as easily as the Teslas.
- yellowapple 9y ago
  My own observations of Honda vehicles suggest differently, but I have very few observations of Tesla vehicles, so I don't really have enough of a point of comparison to really disagree with that assertion.
- FussyZeus 9y ago
  I'm not drinking anybody's kool-aid. If you think a 691 bhp Tesla is going to wear it's parts the same way as a 278 bhp Accord, I have no words for you. That's not even taking into account the much higher acceleration forces, G-forces, etc. that the parts in a Tesla are going to be dealing with, plus the fact that it has a completely different center of gravity and that affects how every component of the suspension wears. I'm not saying Tesla build quality is higher or lower, I'm saying it's comparing apples and oranges. Once Tesla has a production everyman's car available, then you can actually say something. I know five people who own Model S's and they do not drive them like Accords, and if their stories are anything to go by, most people who own them drive them like performance cars. That means hard corners, rapid acceleration and deceleration, and high speeds (and given the crap quality of our roads around here, a lot of turbulence too). It's also worth noting that Honda's have decades upon decades of previous models to build off of. Tesla's been around since what, 2003? And they didn't have a car to show until 2008.
  - dpark 9y ago
    > If you think a 691 bhp Tesla is going to wear it's parts the same way as a 278 bhp Accord... Literally no one said that. And that wasn't the criticism of your comment. The criticism was that you asserted that Hondas would be as reliable as Ferraris if they were driven hard. Lots of people do drive their Hondas hard. They replace the exhaust and lower the car and maybe throw on a wing and pretend they're on a track all the time. They drive these things hard as hell and they hold up very well. > I'm not saying Tesla build quality is higher or lower, I'm saying it's comparing apples and oranges. It's not apples and oranges. It's cars and cars. Yes, people drive their Teslas harder than their Nissan Leafs. What about M5s? How do Teslas compare? They should be far more reliable due to the vastly simpler drivetrain. Are they? > It's also worth noting that Honda's have decades upon decades of previous models to build off of. Tesla's been around since what, 2003? And they didn't have a car to show until 2008. So your argument about Tesla reliability is essentially that they are unreliable, because they're new?
dom0 9y ago
A Mercedes limousine is hardly exotic, and neither is it unreliable.

jbmorgado 9y ago

What I found the most interesting in that comparison is that the Tesla, although having a lot more problems in other areas, had 0% issues in brakes and suspension. Are they using some different much more advanced technology for those parts, or it's just some problem with the repair data?

jdcarr 9y ago
I can only speak for the brakes. Teslas use regenerative braking on the motor before falling back to traditional frictional brake pads as I understand it. Essentially the motor is put in reverse and that drains off speed. That means less wear on the brakes and so they last much, much longer than an ICE car.
- vkou 9y ago
  ICE hybrids use regenerative breaking.
- woobar 9y ago
  My ICE car has regenerative braking. So this is not something exclusive to the EVs.
  - eggnet 9y ago
    Regenerative braking only works if there is spare battery capacity to absorb the energy. In general that requires a large battery to be useful. A normal car battery is nowhere near large enough and is generally topped off by the alternator. My ICE car has regenerative braking as well, but I certainly didn't buy it for that, nor have I been able to discern the impact of it. I have driven EVs before and the regenerative braking is unmistakable.
  - more_corn 9y ago
    Really? Don't you need a big electric motor for that... and some substantial lithium ion batteries? Is your ICE car a hybrid?