4 ms·

There's what's legally required, and there's what's morally required. Here's a guy who did some serious soul-searching and said "holy shit, maybe I'm wrong on a

by mabbo 9y ago

There's what's legally required, and there's what's morally required. Here's a guy who did some serious soul-searching and said "holy shit, maybe I'm wrong on a very bad way". It's about doing more than what he is bare minimum allowed to get away with. He's taking personal responsibility for his actions, openly and publicly. That takes a level of maturity and openness that I know is hard, and I fully respect. All that he missed, in my opinion, is what his next steps are, and how going forward he can assure that this won't happen again. It sounds like he does have plans, but a good apology goes "I was wrong; here's why/how I was wrong; here's what I'm going to do in the future so that I don't repeat the mistake".

theWatcher37 9y ago
But it won't be enough, it won't be seen as positive, and like half the comments in this thread show once you're outed as a PC heretic you're a non-entity. Read through the smarmy "he doesn't mean it" comments all over this thread to see what I mean. This culture is toxic in the tech community and needs to stop.
- jackmott 9y ago
  The culture of being being mad at sexual harassment offenders even when they apologize is what is toxic in the tech community. ok
  - jhall1468 9y ago
    Sexual harrasment? What he did was unethical, immoral and objectively wrong, sexual harrasment is a crime. This wasn't a crime. I'm sure, as a perfect individual you've never done anything unethical or immoral. As such, your "never forgive" attitude is perfectly justifiable.
    - masondixon 9y ago
      > objectively wrong Where can I find a list of "objectively wrong" things, and is there some kind of formal process to challenge them?
      - jhall1468 9y ago
        Let's make one: 1. Sexual advances towards people you hold power over. So far so good.
        masondixon 9y ago
        And if someone you are interested in sleeping with does it to you (whilst holding power over you) - you are going to complain about that?
  - raleighm 9y ago
    Did folks who flagged this understand it was sarcastic?
- dredmorbius 9y ago
  Not being enough doesn't make the public apology a wrong thing. It is part of the solution. It's also a very loud social signal.
kakarot 9y ago
Well he did mention he began counseling a month ago.
wand3r 9y ago
I think it was a great PR move. I don't know the depth of the situation but if he simply said "idk if I should hire you or hit on you", then I think most people are going to read the apology coming away with the belief he is a victim losing his company for a trifle. I did at least. If this was the extent, and he didn't touch her or send lewd photos, frankly I'm angry for him. A society that requires this level of mea culpa for telling a mutual acquintance that was potentially interested in a job over drinks that you were interested in seeing them socially is fucking baffling. Conversely, (again based on my less than complete knowledge of situation) it seems equally rediculous to say that she made unwanted advances to 500 Startups. They were in a social setting and it isn't clear they were hiring for something she qualified for. Should she apologize for leveraging her relationship with his acquintance to use a social situation professionally? Of course not! Dave did a borderline unethical thing in that scenario and based on the NYT article which is scant with details, I'd at most email her an apology for misreading the situation and being unprofessional

by mabbo 9y ago

theWatcher37 9y ago

But it won't be enough, it won't be seen as positive, and like half the comments in this thread show once you're outed as a PC heretic you're a non-entity. Read through the smarmy "he doesn't mean it" comments all over this thread to see what I mean. This culture is toxic in the tech community and needs to stop.

jackmott 9y ago
The culture of being being mad at sexual harassment offenders even when they apologize is what is toxic in the tech community. ok
- jhall1468 9y ago
  Sexual harrasment? What he did was unethical, immoral and objectively wrong, sexual harrasment is a crime. This wasn't a crime. I'm sure, as a perfect individual you've never done anything unethical or immoral. As such, your "never forgive" attitude is perfectly justifiable.
  - masondixon 9y ago
    > objectively wrong Where can I find a list of "objectively wrong" things, and is there some kind of formal process to challenge them?
    - jhall1468 9y ago
      Let's make one: 1. Sexual advances towards people you hold power over. So far so good.
      - masondixon 9y ago
        And if someone you are interested in sleeping with does it to you (whilst holding power over you) - you are going to complain about that?
- raleighm 9y ago
  Did folks who flagged this understand it was sarcastic?
dredmorbius 9y ago
Not being enough doesn't make the public apology a wrong thing. It is part of the solution. It's also a very loud social signal.

kakarot 9y ago

Well he did mention he began counseling a month ago.

wand3r 9y ago

I think it was a great PR move. I don't know the depth of the situation but if he simply said "idk if I should hire you or hit on you", then I think most people are going to read the apology coming away with the belief he is a victim losing his company for a trifle. I did at least. If this was the extent, and he didn't touch her or send lewd photos, frankly I'm angry for him. A society that requires this level of mea culpa for telling a mutual acquintance that was potentially interested in a job over drinks that you were interested in seeing them socially is fucking baffling. Conversely, (again based on my less than complete knowledge of situation) it seems equally rediculous to say that she made unwanted advances to 500 Startups. They were in a social setting and it isn't clear they were hiring for something she qualified for. Should she apologize for leveraging her relationship with his acquintance to use a social situation professionally? Of course not! Dave did a borderline unethical thing in that scenario and based on the NYT article which is scant with details, I'd at most email her an apology for misreading the situation and being unprofessional