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> Next time you hear "a constant murmur" of harassment, racism, or other bad behaviour, _believe it_. Um, no? There's a constant murmur of racism in SV compan
by khazhoux 9y ago
> Next time you hear "a constant murmur" of harassment, racism, or other bad behaviour, _believe it_.
Um, no?
There's a constant murmur of racism in SV companies. I haven't seen that at all. In fact, the opposite. Doesn't mean there's no racism, but I'd rather have actual examples before I buy into that line.
There's a constant murmur of ageism in tech companies. I haven't seen that either. Plenty of people over 40, over 50 in tech. Fewer over 60, but this is a newish field still.
I've managed to go some 20 years in tech without seeing hardly any guys openly hit on girls at work -- except a couple of cases where they're now married. So why should I just "_believe it_", before reading stories like these recent articles?
- meredydd 9y agoBecause these stories are an object demonstration that this sort of thing can be happening in a blatant, undeniable way - seriously, read those texts - and the men around can never see it. So, "never seeing it" isn't really strong evidence that isn't happening. (Compare catcalls. Female friends I trust tell me this happens to them all the time. Around me? ~Never. But that's cause it happens when I'm not there. Extrapolate.)
- khazhoux 9y agoI don't see any texts that people around me send each other privately, so as far as 1:1 private communication goes, yes I'll "never see it." I'm not doubting the stories posted in these articles. But I'm not going to believe something just because there's a "constant murmur." There was also a constant murmur that Obama hated America, etc. Your catcalls example is not a "murmur," it was people you know, telling you what happened to them. That's different.
- tpush 9y agoBelieve it or not, there is stuff happening that you are not aware of. If your first reaction to hearing such things is "Well I've never seen it, therefore it probably doesn't exist", maybe some self-reflection is in order.
- khazhoux 9y agoThanks for the tip. I didn't realize other stuff happens around me. But still, there's lots of "constant murmurs" that don't pan out, and in many cases they're driven by agendas. It's easy to make or perpetuate claims when there's no attribution, no specific examples, etc. Just vague innuendos. So if some vague innuendo is contrary to my personal experience, yeah I won't believe it as fact. Kudos to these women for bringing VC sexism out of the realm of murmurs.
- tpush 9y agoSure, I'm not saying you should 100% believe everything you hear. Just that dismissing such things outright based on a lack of personal experience is also not the right way.
- khazhoux 9y agoDismissing would be wrong. Absolutely! The poster above me said (and emphasized) that when there's constant murmurs, you should _believe it_. Very wrong. Keep an open mind, but don't "believe" it outright just yet.
- tripzilch 9y agoYou're not from the US (originally), are you :) Polarising is a cultural thing there. "You're either with us or against us". (I guess it's a cultural thing from their two-party system or something)
- rtpg 9y agobecause things happen outside your immediate circle? Like maybe you work at a better company than most? For example, if on your team of 20 engineers you have 3 women, then your team is already above the national average. It's for the same reason you can think there's systemic racism in the American policing system without thinking that your cousin is racist because they're a cop.