8 ms·

999 was crappy design for "emergency" as, in the analog era, it would take almost 9x the time to dial it as that of a number like 111 or 112.

jimmytidey 9y ago
I was told it was selected because it can be dialed in the dark - just go all the way way with the rotor three times. I've always found that 999 sounds like an emergency, the biggest number. 112 seems absolutely arbitrary to me.
- celticninja 9y ago
  With 112 it sounds like 111 is where it's really at but we get the 112 service.
- deleted 9y ago
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comstock 9y ago
Well the Wikipedia article on the subject is very instructive: "The 9-9-9 format was chosen based on the 'button A' and 'button B' design of pre-payment coin-operated public payphones in wide use (first introduced in 1925) which could be easily modified to allow free use of the 9 digit on the rotary dial in addition to the 0 digit (then used to call the operator)" So there were valid technical reasons, as well as 999 being harder to dial by accident. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/999_(emergency_telephone_number) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/999_(emergency_telephone_num...
- noncoml 9y ago
  > So there were valid technical reasons Valid technical reasons and crappy design are not mutually exclusive.
  - ptaipale 9y ago
    Yes, but here it's hardly reasonable to describe the choice of numbers as "crappy design". It's a rational choice: a number that is easy to remember, and accidental calls don't happen too easily, making the service better available for actual emergencies. Britain still talks of 999 only, even if 112 works just the same - today, as extremely few phones use decadic dialing any more, a number that would be represented by just four on-hook pulses is no longer any more of a problem from the point of accidentally dialing it.
    - bmsleight_ 9y ago
      Having to call 999 this week. I did not think 112 or 911 would work. Its the adrenalin that kicks in and 999 is just engrained to us in the UK.
    - noncoml 9y ago
      I don't think your reply follows logically. What I said originally was that 999 is a bad choice as it takes considerably more time to dial. The reply was that there were technical reasons for using 999, for which I replied that the two are not mutually exclusive. Did you mean to reply to my original post maybe?
      - gerdesj 9y ago
        "What I said originally was that 999 is a bad choice as it takes considerably more time to dial." You are probably not old enough to know why you use the word "dial" when you refer to pressing keys. 999 looks wrong on any phone and hence elicits a response, 112 looks like yet another extension. The only reason you associate 112 with emergency services is because that is what you have learned from an early age. I'll assert that 999 is a far better number for an emergency - it does not look anything like any other number that you would want to dial unless you have a real problem.
        noncoml 9y ago
        > You are probably not old enough to know why you use the word "dial" when you refer to pressing keys. Actually it's the opposite. You sound like one who has never tried to "dial" 999 on a rotary dial when seconds are the difference between life and death. 999 in that moment feels like an awful choice. We are taking about emergency and as such the most important thing is time and not the rest of the reasons you mentioned.
PJDK 9y ago
Interestingly the reason is analogue in nature. With pulse dialing a single pulse for a 1 could happen by accident quite easily (e.g. two lines knocking into each other). 999 can't happen accidentally. http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/london/hi/people_and_places/history/newsid_8675000/8675199.stm http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/london/hi/people_and_places/hist...
- noncoml 9y ago
  Isn't that why the number 112 is usually used? Fast to dial, but not as easy to dial by mistake as 111.
  - sambeau 9y ago
    Misdialling short numbers on a rotary phone was easy and common. If your finger slipped out of the dial it would return at that point and dial a shorter (lower) number. The most common point for a finger to slip was at the start of each turn, so if your finger slipped you would mostly dial ones or twos. You cannot dial a 9 in this way. The amount of time it took to dial 999 was inconsequential. Nothing was instant in the days when this protocol was invented.
    - noncoml 9y ago
      There is nothing special about 9 in the rotary dial. It sits between 8 and 0. The reason for choosing nice was not because of misdials.
    - deleted 9y ago
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emilyfm 9y ago
It was the only number that could not be dialled by accident by letting go of the dial too early. The aim wasn't to dial quickly, it was to avoid accidental calls. Rotary dials in New Zealand were the other way around (sending ten minus the number dialled pulses) so the emergency number there was (and still is) 111 for the same reason: the hardest to dial by accident.
- stuaxo 9y ago
  Apparently birds sitting on phone lines could trigger 111.
  - grkvlt 9y ago
    Yes, in e.g. the UK, perhaps, where 1 was two pulses (although they would be more likely to dial 000, I would think) but not in NZ, for the reason given in the comment you replied to.
    - peteri 9y ago
      Pretty sure 1 is just one pulse in the UK. Zero is at the far end of the dial next to 9.
      - grkvlt 9y ago
        You're right, it's been a long time since I used a rotary-dial phone (or even a keypad phone that used pulse dialing...) and information like this gets dropped off the stack of 'useful things to know' eventually ;(
- jayd16 9y ago
  Rotary phones swirl the opposite direction in the southern hemisphere?
- boznz 9y ago
  Never even thought to ask the question and I live here, you learn something new every day..
gerdesj 9y ago
I'm sure I wont be the first or the last to point out that you are clearly too young to remember pulse dialing with a rotary input device. The whole point of 999 was that a nine was the only number you could guarantee to accurately dial blind on a rotary input device with only your sense of touch and a little knowledge about the device itself available to you. I'm also not too sure why any other number would be preferable. 999 really stands out whereas all the other emergency numbers across the world do not. I'll accept that because I'm a Brit that I have been conditioned to 999 being THE emergency number might bias me somewhat but I think my point still stands: 999 is far more obvious than any other emergency number. I do a lot of (modern ie VoIP) telephony work and can only think that the 9 for an outside line plus rubbish dial plans and crap hardware and programming meant that 999 might not work for some systems. I've also explored the "not British" criteria for the number ... 8) Can anyone explain why 999 is not the best emergency number ever chosen?
- jzwinck 9y ago
  If you look at images of rotary phone dials I think you will see that it is 0 and 1 that can be dialed easily without vision. Only in New Zealand can 9 be dialed so easily (they use a different dial, however unbelievably).
  - gerdesj 9y ago
    I used to use the bloody things (I'm 47) - I suspect your research is based on pictures and supposition. At rest the rotary dial was at say null. As soon as you moved it over a number and then released it, that was the number that was dialled. 0 and 1 were first (obvs). When you hit the backstop (a small metal shim) then you had hit nine. It isn't as bad an interface as it might sound. You would get feedback via a series of clicks as the dial returned to null and also via force (springs etc). There really was a good reason for picking 999 originally and the world has moved on since but I still assert that 999 is a far better number (or nowadays: a symbol) for invoking an emergency call than any other number.
    - ficklepickle 9y ago
jaclaz 9y ago
From the Wikipedia article: >As it happens, the choice of 999 was fortunate for accessibility reasons, compared with e.g. lower numbers, because in the dark or in dense smoke 999 could be dialled by placing a finger one hole away from the dial stop (see the articles on rotary dial and GPO telephones) and rotating the dial to the full extent three times. This enables all users including the visually impaired to easily dial the emergency number. It is also the case that it is relatively easy for 111, and other low-number sequences, to be called accidentally, including when transmission wires making momentary contact produce a pulse similar to dialling (e.g. when overhead cables touch in high winds) So maybe by fortune only, but it doesn't sound so crappy. On the other hand, anecdotally (we have had 112 or 113 here for as long as I can remember) I have seen reports on newspapers of people (with movenments limited, like being tied or wounded or however impaired) that managed to "dial" these "low" numbers by just quickly pushing and releasing the hook button with their foot (or nose, etc.).
- vorg 9y ago
  > "dial" these "low" numbers by just quickly pushing and releasing the hook button In New Zealand as a kid, we dialed numbers using the hook by subtracting the digits from 10 because the rotary digits were labelled the reverse of other countries. The pay phones there in the 1970's required 3 two-cent coins for a call, but not if you dialed using the hook. In the first season of The Wire, the drug dealers use the same subtract-from-10 system, but it's for their secret code using push-button pay phones.

jimmytidey 9y ago

I was told it was selected because it can be dialed in the dark - just go all the way way with the rotor three times. I've always found that 999 sounds like an emergency, the biggest number. 112 seems absolutely arbitrary to me.

celticninja 9y ago
With 112 it sounds like 111 is where it's really at but we get the 112 service.
deleted 9y ago
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deleted 9y ago
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comstock 9y ago

Well the Wikipedia article on the subject is very instructive: "The 9-9-9 format was chosen based on the 'button A' and 'button B' design of pre-payment coin-operated public payphones in wide use (first introduced in 1925) which could be easily modified to allow free use of the 9 digit on the rotary dial in addition to the 0 digit (then used to call the operator)" So there were valid technical reasons, as well as 999 being harder to dial by accident. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/999_(emergency_telephone_number) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/999_(emergency_telephone_num...

noncoml 9y ago
> So there were valid technical reasons Valid technical reasons and crappy design are not mutually exclusive.
- ptaipale 9y ago
  Yes, but here it's hardly reasonable to describe the choice of numbers as "crappy design". It's a rational choice: a number that is easy to remember, and accidental calls don't happen too easily, making the service better available for actual emergencies. Britain still talks of 999 only, even if 112 works just the same - today, as extremely few phones use decadic dialing any more, a number that would be represented by just four on-hook pulses is no longer any more of a problem from the point of accidentally dialing it.
  - bmsleight_ 9y ago
    Having to call 999 this week. I did not think 112 or 911 would work. Its the adrenalin that kicks in and 999 is just engrained to us in the UK.
  - noncoml 9y ago
    I don't think your reply follows logically. What I said originally was that 999 is a bad choice as it takes considerably more time to dial. The reply was that there were technical reasons for using 999, for which I replied that the two are not mutually exclusive. Did you mean to reply to my original post maybe?
    - gerdesj 9y ago
      "What I said originally was that 999 is a bad choice as it takes considerably more time to dial." You are probably not old enough to know why you use the word "dial" when you refer to pressing keys. 999 looks wrong on any phone and hence elicits a response, 112 looks like yet another extension. The only reason you associate 112 with emergency services is because that is what you have learned from an early age. I'll assert that 999 is a far better number for an emergency - it does not look anything like any other number that you would want to dial unless you have a real problem.
      - noncoml 9y ago
        > You are probably not old enough to know why you use the word "dial" when you refer to pressing keys. Actually it's the opposite. You sound like one who has never tried to "dial" 999 on a rotary dial when seconds are the difference between life and death. 999 in that moment feels like an awful choice. We are taking about emergency and as such the most important thing is time and not the rest of the reasons you mentioned.

PJDK 9y ago

Interestingly the reason is analogue in nature. With pulse dialing a single pulse for a 1 could happen by accident quite easily (e.g. two lines knocking into each other). 999 can't happen accidentally. http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/london/hi/people_and_places/history/newsid_8675000/8675199.stm http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/london/hi/people_and_places/hist...

noncoml 9y ago
Isn't that why the number 112 is usually used? Fast to dial, but not as easy to dial by mistake as 111.
- sambeau 9y ago
  Misdialling short numbers on a rotary phone was easy and common. If your finger slipped out of the dial it would return at that point and dial a shorter (lower) number. The most common point for a finger to slip was at the start of each turn, so if your finger slipped you would mostly dial ones or twos. You cannot dial a 9 in this way. The amount of time it took to dial 999 was inconsequential. Nothing was instant in the days when this protocol was invented.
  - noncoml 9y ago
    There is nothing special about 9 in the rotary dial. It sits between 8 and 0. The reason for choosing nice was not because of misdials.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]

emilyfm 9y ago

It was the only number that could not be dialled by accident by letting go of the dial too early. The aim wasn't to dial quickly, it was to avoid accidental calls. Rotary dials in New Zealand were the other way around (sending ten minus the number dialled pulses) so the emergency number there was (and still is) 111 for the same reason: the hardest to dial by accident.

stuaxo 9y ago
Apparently birds sitting on phone lines could trigger 111.
- grkvlt 9y ago
  Yes, in e.g. the UK, perhaps, where 1 was two pulses (although they would be more likely to dial 000, I would think) but not in NZ, for the reason given in the comment you replied to.
  - peteri 9y ago
    Pretty sure 1 is just one pulse in the UK. Zero is at the far end of the dial next to 9.
    - grkvlt 9y ago
      You're right, it's been a long time since I used a rotary-dial phone (or even a keypad phone that used pulse dialing...) and information like this gets dropped off the stack of 'useful things to know' eventually ;(
jayd16 9y ago
Rotary phones swirl the opposite direction in the southern hemisphere?
boznz 9y ago
Never even thought to ask the question and I live here, you learn something new every day..

gerdesj 9y ago

I'm sure I wont be the first or the last to point out that you are clearly too young to remember pulse dialing with a rotary input device. The whole point of 999 was that a nine was the only number you could guarantee to accurately dial blind on a rotary input device with only your sense of touch and a little knowledge about the device itself available to you. I'm also not too sure why any other number would be preferable. 999 really stands out whereas all the other emergency numbers across the world do not. I'll accept that because I'm a Brit that I have been conditioned to 999 being THE emergency number might bias me somewhat but I think my point still stands: 999 is far more obvious than any other emergency number. I do a lot of (modern ie VoIP) telephony work and can only think that the 9 for an outside line plus rubbish dial plans and crap hardware and programming meant that 999 might not work for some systems. I've also explored the "not British" criteria for the number ... 8) Can anyone explain why 999 is not the best emergency number ever chosen?

jzwinck 9y ago
If you look at images of rotary phone dials I think you will see that it is 0 and 1 that can be dialed easily without vision. Only in New Zealand can 9 be dialed so easily (they use a different dial, however unbelievably).
- gerdesj 9y ago
  I used to use the bloody things (I'm 47) - I suspect your research is based on pictures and supposition. At rest the rotary dial was at say null. As soon as you moved it over a number and then released it, that was the number that was dialled. 0 and 1 were first (obvs). When you hit the backstop (a small metal shim) then you had hit nine. It isn't as bad an interface as it might sound. You would get feedback via a series of clicks as the dial returned to null and also via force (springs etc). There really was a good reason for picking 999 originally and the world has moved on since but I still assert that 999 is a far better number (or nowadays: a symbol) for invoking an emergency call than any other number.
  - ficklepickle 9y ago

jaclaz 9y ago

From the Wikipedia article: >As it happens, the choice of 999 was fortunate for accessibility reasons, compared with e.g. lower numbers, because in the dark or in dense smoke 999 could be dialled by placing a finger one hole away from the dial stop (see the articles on rotary dial and GPO telephones) and rotating the dial to the full extent three times. This enables all users including the visually impaired to easily dial the emergency number. It is also the case that it is relatively easy for 111, and other low-number sequences, to be called accidentally, including when transmission wires making momentary contact produce a pulse similar to dialling (e.g. when overhead cables touch in high winds) So maybe by fortune only, but it doesn't sound so crappy. On the other hand, anecdotally (we have had 112 or 113 here for as long as I can remember) I have seen reports on newspapers of people (with movenments limited, like being tied or wounded or however impaired) that managed to "dial" these "low" numbers by just quickly pushing and releasing the hook button with their foot (or nose, etc.).

vorg 9y ago
> "dial" these "low" numbers by just quickly pushing and releasing the hook button In New Zealand as a kid, we dialed numbers using the hook by subtracting the digits from 10 because the rotary digits were labelled the reverse of other countries. The pay phones there in the 1970's required 3 two-cent coins for a call, but not if you dialed using the hook. In the first season of The Wire, the drug dealers use the same subtract-from-10 system, but it's for their secret code using push-button pay phones.