3 ms·

>I could not care less about what is the colour of people writing it, their sexual orientations, or how well represented they all are. It may seem relevant to y

by vesak 9y ago

>I could not care less about what is the colour of people writing it, their sexual orientations, or how well represented they all are. It may seem relevant to you but it certainly is not to me. Well, you can certainly ignore all that and just use the language. Nothing forces you to do these things, they're just forcing themselves to do these things.

humanrebar 9y ago
It's a small faction of people that self identify as cissomething. Much of modern cultural discussions are about language: what is "marriage" for instance, what does "gender" mean, what is "racist", what is "privilege". Asking people to give up and use someone else's language is unfair. In different ways respectable thinkers like Orwell and Chomsky say language is very important. And I think the position being espoused but misunderstood is that people would like to take different approaches to promoting diversity (perhaps by being personally inclusive and politically neutral) but these sorts of codes of conduct are not conducive to those approach. It's not fair to say this is the way to improve the situation. Or that the situation can be improved this way at all. It may be shocking to people comfortable in American coastal culture, but this sort of thing is controversial (look at this thread!) and unnecessarily combative to people from other cultures. Furthermore, it's not inclusive to many people because it takes a specific viewpoint in many complicated but intentional ways.
SagelyGuru 9y ago
>Well, you can certainly ignore all that and just use the language. Nothing forces you to do these things, they're just forcing themselves to do these things. I am old and non-native English speaker and I love Rust. Thus I would have liked to participate and I could have ticked some of the boxes. The funding to a conference of my choice would certainly have been very welcome. Then I tried to reflect on it more honestly. Does my age and my not so good English really make me into such a valuable contributor to a Rust conference? I do not think so. Other qualities might but you do not list those. So I ended up excluding myself. To clarify then: when I wrote that I am not interested in your obsession with identity politics, what I really meant was that, as a condition of active entry to the Rust community.
sacado2 9y ago
Not OP, but at my workplace, we never discuss sexual orientation, race, religious belief or gender of coworkers, because that would be very unprofessional. So, no, I can't ignore all that and just us the language. I can't use a language in a professional context when I consider the core team to be unprofessional. But that's a nice social experiment and I'll probably use rust for my personal projects.

by vesak 9y ago

humanrebar 9y ago

It's a small faction of people that self identify as cissomething. Much of modern cultural discussions are about language: what is "marriage" for instance, what does "gender" mean, what is "racist", what is "privilege". Asking people to give up and use someone else's language is unfair. In different ways respectable thinkers like Orwell and Chomsky say language is very important. And I think the position being espoused but misunderstood is that people would like to take different approaches to promoting diversity (perhaps by being personally inclusive and politically neutral) but these sorts of codes of conduct are not conducive to those approach. It's not fair to say this is the way to improve the situation. Or that the situation can be improved this way at all. It may be shocking to people comfortable in American coastal culture, but this sort of thing is controversial (look at this thread!) and unnecessarily combative to people from other cultures. Furthermore, it's not inclusive to many people because it takes a specific viewpoint in many complicated but intentional ways.

SagelyGuru 9y ago

>Well, you can certainly ignore all that and just use the language. Nothing forces you to do these things, they're just forcing themselves to do these things. I am old and non-native English speaker and I love Rust. Thus I would have liked to participate and I could have ticked some of the boxes. The funding to a conference of my choice would certainly have been very welcome. Then I tried to reflect on it more honestly. Does my age and my not so good English really make me into such a valuable contributor to a Rust conference? I do not think so. Other qualities might but you do not list those. So I ended up excluding myself. To clarify then: when I wrote that I am not interested in your obsession with identity politics, what I really meant was that, as a condition of active entry to the Rust community.

sacado2 9y ago

Not OP, but at my workplace, we never discuss sexual orientation, race, religious belief or gender of coworkers, because that would be very unprofessional. So, no, I can't ignore all that and just us the language. I can't use a language in a professional context when I consider the core team to be unprofessional. But that's a nice social experiment and I'll probably use rust for my personal projects.