4 ms·

If by working you mean rapidly transferring wealth into fewer sets of hands, yes.

klodolph 9y ago
Are you saying that avoiding deflation and volatility is what consolidates wealth? How? Or are you saying that quantitative easing consolidates wealth? How? Or are you just inserting an unrelated complaint into the discussion?
- Frogolocalypse 9y ago
  I think I'm being clear enough. There has been an objectively massive shift in wealth between low and middle income earners to wealthy asset accumulators over the past 30 years, and that has accelerated over the past 10. This solution you're lauding has been engineered by exactly those asset accumulators as a response to problems caused by exactly those asset accumulators. It's like you're cheering on an arsonist because after the fire he lit that has burned down your house, he hands you a bucket of urine to help put the fire out.
  - klodolph 9y ago
    So, I don't understand what you were trying to say, and when I ask for clarification, you just double down instead of actually answering my questions? Come on, I just want to understand what your viewpoint is, but if you don't want me to understand your viewpoint, I guess that's your prerogative.
    - Frogolocalypse 9y ago
      Your questions : 1. Strawman. It is the concept of value itself that has been perverted through this process. 2. Because organisations (i.e. banks and the owners of their service channels) closer to the feed of treasuries suffer the least of the effects of monetary expansion. 3. I thought we were talking about inflation and bitcoin as a store of value?
      - klodolph 9y ago
        When the question is, "Are you saying X?", "Strawman" is a nonsensical answer. I wasn't asking rhetorical questions, I was asking questions because I didn't understand what argument you were making and I wanted clarification. That's pretty much the opposite of a strawman argument right there. Furthermore, I don't know how to make heads nor tails of the statement that the "concept of value itself" has been "perverted". Such a vague and sentimental notion could mean many different things. The criticism that our economic system aggregates wealth in the hands of a few is valid, but at least the dollar isn't suffering from deflation and extreme volatility, which is what makes it viable as a unit of account (unlike bitcoin). I wasn't considering bitcoins or dollars as stores of value, just as units for measuring value and devices for transmitting it. Maybe at some point bitcoin will overcome these problems, but for now, I'm rather glad a graph of the dollar's value looks nothing like the graph shown in the original comment.
        Frogolocalypse 9y ago
        Let's bring ourselves back then to what was being stated. You said : > The US, UK, and Japan are all currently fighting deflation with QE policies, which seem to be working fairly well. ... and I said : > If by working you mean rapidly transferring wealth into fewer sets of hands, yes. ... and then you said : > Are you saying that avoiding deflation and volatility is what consolidates wealth? I was talking about the effect of QE. That effect being the objective fact that money has transferred from people with less to people with more. You were inventing a strawman about the theory that if the people who were doing this didn't get what they wanted, we would have 'deflation and volatility'? Seen the house markets over the past 30 years? Looks pretty volatile to me, so it doesn't sound like whoever is making policy has their fingers on the pulse, do they? Sounds more like a marketing gimmick to me. I had to write a paragraph of crap to answer a BS premise that had no relationship to the argument at hand. So. Strawman. > Furthermore, I don't know how to make heads nor tails of the statement that the "concept of value itself" has been "perverted" Maybe you got fixated on your strawman. > but at least the dollar isn't suffering from deflation and extreme volatility Yeah. Theft is much better. Here is a gun to your head. Give me what I want or I pull the trigger. But at least you don't have deflation and volatility. Remind me again... how many people went to prison for the GFC?
overcast 9y ago
You mean like Bitcoin, where a relatively small number of people hold the majority of all mined Bitcoin in the world? https://bitconnect.co/bitcoin-news/254/bitcoin-millionaires-how-many-people-hold-all-the-worlds-bitcoins/ https://bitconnect.co/bitcoin-news/254/bitcoin-millionaires-... https://bitcoinprivacy.net/richlist https://bitcoinprivacy.net/richlist
- deleted 9y ago
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- Frogolocalypse 9y ago
  What does that have to do with quantitative easing and deflation?

Are you saying that avoiding deflation and volatility is what consolidates wealth? How? Or are you saying that quantitative easing consolidates wealth? How? Or are you just inserting an unrelated complaint into the discussion?

Frogolocalypse 9y ago
I think I'm being clear enough. There has been an objectively massive shift in wealth between low and middle income earners to wealthy asset accumulators over the past 30 years, and that has accelerated over the past 10. This solution you're lauding has been engineered by exactly those asset accumulators as a response to problems caused by exactly those asset accumulators. It's like you're cheering on an arsonist because after the fire he lit that has burned down your house, he hands you a bucket of urine to help put the fire out.
- klodolph 9y ago
  So, I don't understand what you were trying to say, and when I ask for clarification, you just double down instead of actually answering my questions? Come on, I just want to understand what your viewpoint is, but if you don't want me to understand your viewpoint, I guess that's your prerogative.
  - Frogolocalypse 9y ago
    Your questions : 1. Strawman. It is the concept of value itself that has been perverted through this process. 2. Because organisations (i.e. banks and the owners of their service channels) closer to the feed of treasuries suffer the least of the effects of monetary expansion. 3. I thought we were talking about inflation and bitcoin as a store of value?
    - klodolph 9y ago
      When the question is, "Are you saying X?", "Strawman" is a nonsensical answer. I wasn't asking rhetorical questions, I was asking questions because I didn't understand what argument you were making and I wanted clarification. That's pretty much the opposite of a strawman argument right there. Furthermore, I don't know how to make heads nor tails of the statement that the "concept of value itself" has been "perverted". Such a vague and sentimental notion could mean many different things. The criticism that our economic system aggregates wealth in the hands of a few is valid, but at least the dollar isn't suffering from deflation and extreme volatility, which is what makes it viable as a unit of account (unlike bitcoin). I wasn't considering bitcoins or dollars as stores of value, just as units for measuring value and devices for transmitting it. Maybe at some point bitcoin will overcome these problems, but for now, I'm rather glad a graph of the dollar's value looks nothing like the graph shown in the original comment.
      - Frogolocalypse 9y ago
        Let's bring ourselves back then to what was being stated. You said : > The US, UK, and Japan are all currently fighting deflation with QE policies, which seem to be working fairly well. ... and I said : > If by working you mean rapidly transferring wealth into fewer sets of hands, yes. ... and then you said : > Are you saying that avoiding deflation and volatility is what consolidates wealth? I was talking about the effect of QE. That effect being the objective fact that money has transferred from people with less to people with more. You were inventing a strawman about the theory that if the people who were doing this didn't get what they wanted, we would have 'deflation and volatility'? Seen the house markets over the past 30 years? Looks pretty volatile to me, so it doesn't sound like whoever is making policy has their fingers on the pulse, do they? Sounds more like a marketing gimmick to me. I had to write a paragraph of crap to answer a BS premise that had no relationship to the argument at hand. So. Strawman. > Furthermore, I don't know how to make heads nor tails of the statement that the "concept of value itself" has been "perverted" Maybe you got fixated on your strawman. > but at least the dollar isn't suffering from deflation and extreme volatility Yeah. Theft is much better. Here is a gun to your head. Give me what I want or I pull the trigger. But at least you don't have deflation and volatility. Remind me again... how many people went to prison for the GFC?

overcast 9y ago

You mean like Bitcoin, where a relatively small number of people hold the majority of all mined Bitcoin in the world? https://bitconnect.co/bitcoin-news/254/bitcoin-millionaires-how-many-people-hold-all-the-worlds-bitcoins/ https://bitconnect.co/bitcoin-news/254/bitcoin-millionaires-... https://bitcoinprivacy.net/richlist https://bitcoinprivacy.net/richlist

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
Frogolocalypse 9y ago
What does that have to do with quantitative easing and deflation?