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There are many variations on "living in cities". Some of them involve single-family dwellings and lots of private space. It actually seems to be those models

There are many variations on "living in cities". Some of them involve single-family dwellings and lots of private space. It actually seems to be those models which are most strongly under attack right now.

TulliusCicero 9y ago
They're under attack because they make those cities unaffordable to most, they're a cash transfer from immigrants to the emplaced, from the young to the old. They're under attack because they can't possibly scale. They're under attack because they take more energy and are more hostile to walking, biking, and transit. They're under attack because they're not the natural outcome of people expressing preferences in the market, but rather the result of enforced government zoning regulations. They're under attack because said zoning regulations are social engineering designed to -- in concert with neighborhood-based school district boundaries -- segregate people based on class.
- hueving 9y ago
  And that's why New York city is so affordable?
  - twobyfour 9y ago
    Would it be more affordable if it had only two stories of housing everywhere instead of up to 40? NYC isn't affordable because housing growth can't keep up with population growth.
    - Nav_Panel 9y ago
      If East Queens and Long Island looked like South Brooklyn (incl subway access) rather than like Westchester, NYC would be a lot more affordable. The problem was that Robert Moses built highways at a crucial turning point for greenfield development in NYC, and it's gonna take a lot of effort to reverse these changes.
- maxsilver 9y ago
  > (single family homes with reasonable space) they make those cities unaffordable, they can't possibly scale, they are more hostile to walking, biking, and transit. None of that is actually true. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGbC5j4pG9w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGbC5j4pG9w and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jv6SbFlZMbU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jv6SbFlZMbU Apartments are great for those who want them, but there's nothing wrong or anti-urban about family housing. You can easily give everyone (edit: everyone who wants one) their own single-family detached housing (with privacy, and parking), inside a major city, for really cheap. It would still be 100% supportive of walking, biking, and transit, and can scale for at least the next 100 years. I can state this as a simple fact, because it is, it already exists on Earth today. Wealthier Americans just refuse to let that happen in our own cities. We simply don't build urban housing for families (even in instances where zoning rules do allow it) so families literally can't make that choice. Cities force sprawl, and then complain that decisions must be made to service the sprawl they themselves made.
  - jacobolus 9y ago
    “Everyone”? The first video you linked shows that the specific neighborhood in Tokyo is filled with low-rise and mid-rise apartment buildings.
    - maxsilver 9y ago
      "Everyone" meaning everyone who wants one. The average family making average wages in Tokyo, can afford a brand new detached home inside central Tokyo. The same is not true in any of the top 50 cities in the US. Even the smaller unpopular cities, even the cities that have slower population growth than Tokyo, or have cheaper land than Tokyo.
      - aninhumer 9y ago
        What exactly do you mean by "central Tokyo" here? I'm fairly sure the average family cannot buy a detached house in Ginza for example.
jacobolus 9y ago
Some cities have this nice feature where there are enough studio and 1-bedroom apartments available in low-rise and mid-rise apartment buildings that all the people who want to live in small apartments can afford to, pushing down pricing of all housing including the 4-bedroom single-family houses, and the duplexes, etc. Other cities are zoned to only allow single-family houses on most of their lots, and don’t have enough small apartments, so instead all of the people who want to live in studio apartments end up stuck splitting the rent 3 ways so they can afford to sleep in the dining room of what used to be a single-family house. Due to rent control people living with roommates get locked into their slightly awkward housing situations, and can’t afford to move in with a partner, trade up for a larger space to start a family, or even move when they have a falling out with the roommates. Now the rent price of single family houses goes up to whatever 3 or 4 full-time junior programmer salaries can pay for, all of the families with parents working less lucrative careers can no longer afford the city, and only the richest can afford to ever buy houses.

TulliusCicero 9y ago

They're under attack because they make those cities unaffordable to most, they're a cash transfer from immigrants to the emplaced, from the young to the old. They're under attack because they can't possibly scale. They're under attack because they take more energy and are more hostile to walking, biking, and transit. They're under attack because they're not the natural outcome of people expressing preferences in the market, but rather the result of enforced government zoning regulations. They're under attack because said zoning regulations are social engineering designed to -- in concert with neighborhood-based school district boundaries -- segregate people based on class.

hueving 9y ago
And that's why New York city is so affordable?
- twobyfour 9y ago
  Would it be more affordable if it had only two stories of housing everywhere instead of up to 40? NYC isn't affordable because housing growth can't keep up with population growth.
  - Nav_Panel 9y ago
    If East Queens and Long Island looked like South Brooklyn (incl subway access) rather than like Westchester, NYC would be a lot more affordable. The problem was that Robert Moses built highways at a crucial turning point for greenfield development in NYC, and it's gonna take a lot of effort to reverse these changes.
maxsilver 9y ago
> (single family homes with reasonable space) they make those cities unaffordable, they can't possibly scale, they are more hostile to walking, biking, and transit. None of that is actually true. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGbC5j4pG9w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGbC5j4pG9w and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jv6SbFlZMbU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jv6SbFlZMbU Apartments are great for those who want them, but there's nothing wrong or anti-urban about family housing. You can easily give everyone (edit: everyone who wants one) their own single-family detached housing (with privacy, and parking), inside a major city, for really cheap. It would still be 100% supportive of walking, biking, and transit, and can scale for at least the next 100 years. I can state this as a simple fact, because it is, it already exists on Earth today. Wealthier Americans just refuse to let that happen in our own cities. We simply don't build urban housing for families (even in instances where zoning rules do allow it) so families literally can't make that choice. Cities force sprawl, and then complain that decisions must be made to service the sprawl they themselves made.
- jacobolus 9y ago
  “Everyone”? The first video you linked shows that the specific neighborhood in Tokyo is filled with low-rise and mid-rise apartment buildings.
  - maxsilver 9y ago
    "Everyone" meaning everyone who wants one. The average family making average wages in Tokyo, can afford a brand new detached home inside central Tokyo. The same is not true in any of the top 50 cities in the US. Even the smaller unpopular cities, even the cities that have slower population growth than Tokyo, or have cheaper land than Tokyo.
    - aninhumer 9y ago
      What exactly do you mean by "central Tokyo" here? I'm fairly sure the average family cannot buy a detached house in Ginza for example.

jacobolus 9y ago

Some cities have this nice feature where there are enough studio and 1-bedroom apartments available in low-rise and mid-rise apartment buildings that all the people who want to live in small apartments can afford to, pushing down pricing of all housing including the 4-bedroom single-family houses, and the duplexes, etc. Other cities are zoned to only allow single-family houses on most of their lots, and don’t have enough small apartments, so instead all of the people who want to live in studio apartments end up stuck splitting the rent 3 ways so they can afford to sleep in the dining room of what used to be a single-family house. Due to rent control people living with roommates get locked into their slightly awkward housing situations, and can’t afford to move in with a partner, trade up for a larger space to start a family, or even move when they have a falling out with the roommates. Now the rent price of single family houses goes up to whatever 3 or 4 full-time junior programmer salaries can pay for, all of the families with parents working less lucrative careers can no longer afford the city, and only the richest can afford to ever buy houses.