4 ms·

I can't even fully grasp what you're getting at. It really feels like you're grasping at straws.

ithinkinstereo 9y ago
How so? It's perfectly okay for pilots to be spiritual/religious. It's not okay for pilots to take time, in the middle of dealing with an engine failure, to ask passengers to "pray" for a safe resolution. The golden rule for pilots when dealing with an in-flight emergency is to "Aviate, Navigate, Communicate" [1], not "Pray". https://www.faasafety.gov/gslac/ALC/course_content.aspx?cID=40 https://www.faasafety.gov/gslac/ALC/course_content.aspx?cID=...
- dingaling 9y ago
  Just as an aside, that's not technically a rule but a guideline. For example at a busy airport, failing to communicate during an emergency might prove more dangerous ( to self and others ) than failing to navigate.
  - jimmywanger 9y ago
    Communicating panic and lack of control to your passengers is never safe. You will be absolutely honest and clear with ATC and any escorts/emergency vehicles regarding your current status, but you cannot ever let that bleed into your communications with the passengers. In all communication with passengers, you need to be about as calm as if you're just taking a walk in the park. "Folks, we're making an unexpected detour to check out some technical issues that came up. We might be delayed a few hours, but the ground crew will book you on the next flight available, and work with you on rescheduling your transfers."
    - lb1lf 9y ago
      To quote Eric Moody, captain of what was at the time the world's largest commercial glider after a quadruple engine failure: "Ladies and gentlemen, this is your captain speaking. We have a small problem. All four engines have stopped. We are doing our damnedest to get them going again. I trust you are not in too much distress." https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Airways_Flight_9 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Airways_Flight_9
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
Veratyr 9y ago
I don't think this is grasping at straws. It's absolutely unprofessional for a pilot to suggest that the plane's survival is reliant on divine intervention. A pilot should be operating the plane and making decisions solely on well accepted science and should definitely not be scaring the passengers with talk like that.
- victorhooi 9y ago
  To me, the two points are completely orthogonal. Whether he's religious or not, or decides to pray or not - is separate to how good a pilot he is. (And honestly, sometimes these things are outside of his hands). There are plenty of religious people who are good pilots. There are plenty of non-religious people who are good pilots. Unless you have some meaningful data, you can't really make a conclusion either way. In terms of asking somebody to pray - I've never been particularly offended by that, no matter what the faith of the person. (I have my own faith). Unless of course they were asking me to pray for something that in itself is offensive - such as say, death to all Jews or something. If they're asking me to pray for say, the safe return of their husband, or that their puppy dog might recover - I'd feel like a real jerk if I just said no, instead of just going, um sure? If they want me to pray with them in their language, sure.
  - Veratyr 9y ago
    > Whether he's religious or not, or decides to pray or not - is separate to how good a pilot he is. I totally agree with this. A pilot can be religious, he's free to pray in a bad situation, particularly if it helps him calm down. However this is separate from the pilot's work. His religion should not affect his decision making as a pilot. > In terms of asking somebody to pray - I've never been particularly offended by that, no matter what the faith of the person. It's not that praying is offensive, it's that his suggestion that the passengers pray implies that their survival is at least somewhat dependent on divine intervention. Going back to my first point, it's fine for the pilot or passengers to believe this in a personal capacity but in a professional capacity it's the pilot's responsibility to remain purely in a realm of fact. Plus, this implication could (and very well should) scare the shit out of the passengers. You definitely don't want them panicking.
ClassyJacket 9y ago
Pretty straightforward - the pilot said he was relying on magic to save them all instead of doing it himself. That's pretty unprofessional. He should be focussed on doing the job. He can be religious at home but he should not bring that up with the passengers any more than he should say "Hey everyone, we might crash, but my friend Steve, who isn't a pilot, and isn't here, will fix this!"
dang 9y ago
Would you please stop posting unsubstantive comments to HN? Especially on divisive topics, where they predictably act as flamebait. We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14633958 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14633958 and marked it off-topic.

How so? It's perfectly okay for pilots to be spiritual/religious. It's not okay for pilots to take time, in the middle of dealing with an engine failure, to ask passengers to "pray" for a safe resolution. The golden rule for pilots when dealing with an in-flight emergency is to "Aviate, Navigate, Communicate" [1], not "Pray". https://www.faasafety.gov/gslac/ALC/course_content.aspx?cID=40 https://www.faasafety.gov/gslac/ALC/course_content.aspx?cID=...

dingaling 9y ago
Just as an aside, that's not technically a rule but a guideline. For example at a busy airport, failing to communicate during an emergency might prove more dangerous ( to self and others ) than failing to navigate.
- jimmywanger 9y ago
  Communicating panic and lack of control to your passengers is never safe. You will be absolutely honest and clear with ATC and any escorts/emergency vehicles regarding your current status, but you cannot ever let that bleed into your communications with the passengers. In all communication with passengers, you need to be about as calm as if you're just taking a walk in the park. "Folks, we're making an unexpected detour to check out some technical issues that came up. We might be delayed a few hours, but the ground crew will book you on the next flight available, and work with you on rescheduling your transfers."
  - lb1lf 9y ago
    To quote Eric Moody, captain of what was at the time the world's largest commercial glider after a quadruple engine failure: "Ladies and gentlemen, this is your captain speaking. We have a small problem. All four engines have stopped. We are doing our damnedest to get them going again. I trust you are not in too much distress." https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Airways_Flight_9 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Airways_Flight_9
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]

Veratyr 9y ago

I don't think this is grasping at straws. It's absolutely unprofessional for a pilot to suggest that the plane's survival is reliant on divine intervention. A pilot should be operating the plane and making decisions solely on well accepted science and should definitely not be scaring the passengers with talk like that.

victorhooi 9y ago
To me, the two points are completely orthogonal. Whether he's religious or not, or decides to pray or not - is separate to how good a pilot he is. (And honestly, sometimes these things are outside of his hands). There are plenty of religious people who are good pilots. There are plenty of non-religious people who are good pilots. Unless you have some meaningful data, you can't really make a conclusion either way. In terms of asking somebody to pray - I've never been particularly offended by that, no matter what the faith of the person. (I have my own faith). Unless of course they were asking me to pray for something that in itself is offensive - such as say, death to all Jews or something. If they're asking me to pray for say, the safe return of their husband, or that their puppy dog might recover - I'd feel like a real jerk if I just said no, instead of just going, um sure? If they want me to pray with them in their language, sure.
- Veratyr 9y ago
  > Whether he's religious or not, or decides to pray or not - is separate to how good a pilot he is. I totally agree with this. A pilot can be religious, he's free to pray in a bad situation, particularly if it helps him calm down. However this is separate from the pilot's work. His religion should not affect his decision making as a pilot. > In terms of asking somebody to pray - I've never been particularly offended by that, no matter what the faith of the person. It's not that praying is offensive, it's that his suggestion that the passengers pray implies that their survival is at least somewhat dependent on divine intervention. Going back to my first point, it's fine for the pilot or passengers to believe this in a personal capacity but in a professional capacity it's the pilot's responsibility to remain purely in a realm of fact. Plus, this implication could (and very well should) scare the shit out of the passengers. You definitely don't want them panicking.

ClassyJacket 9y ago

Pretty straightforward - the pilot said he was relying on magic to save them all instead of doing it himself. That's pretty unprofessional. He should be focussed on doing the job. He can be religious at home but he should not bring that up with the passengers any more than he should say "Hey everyone, we might crash, but my friend Steve, who isn't a pilot, and isn't here, will fix this!"

dang 9y ago

Would you please stop posting unsubstantive comments to HN? Especially on divisive topics, where they predictably act as flamebait. We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14633958 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14633958 and marked it off-topic.