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Added to which the cheapest solar panels in China are often subjected a tariffs of up to 60%. The "coal/gas/nuclear funded free markets lobby" (ALEC, etc.) who

Added to which the cheapest solar panels in China are often subjected a tariffs of up to 60%. The "coal/gas/nuclear funded free markets lobby" (ALEC, etc.) who whine incessantly about hairdresser licensing went awfully quiet about that one.

bsder 9y ago
> Added to which the cheapest solar panels in China are often subjected a tariffs of up to 60%. Because they were both substandard and being dumped. And they drove a lot of reliable US manufacturers under. In addition, a LOT of installers went under because the warranty they offered assumed that they wouldn't have to show up again for 10 years. 3 years on they're getting warranty calls because the solar cells were failing. Of course, the Chinese manufacturer was nowhere to be found. There is a big difference between disposable electronics being too cheap and a capital expense being too cheap. Until US businesses can sue Chinese businesses for bad practices and win "the market" won't sort itself out. In the meantime, tariffs are a good working solution.
- sqeaky 9y ago
  The market figures this kind of stuff out. Reputable installers won't use the cheap cells and will warn their customers off the cheaper selling stuff that won't break in a few years. If the market couldn't things like double and triple pane windows wouldn't be able to out-compete single pane windows. We have done it with other goods too. American car companies got away with selling substandard stuff for a long time but revenues kept shrinking as Americans bought more foreign brands. It a major market disruption and a bailout for the car companies to right themselves. Sometimes it takes a while, sometimes a touch of government regulation makes it happen faster but when a business do shady stuff they punish themselves in the long run if there are legitimate options competing with them in the market.
  - bsder 9y ago
    > The market figures this kind of stuff out. Reputable installers won't use the cheap cells and will warn their customers off the cheaper selling stuff that won't break in a few years. How many years does your reputable solar cell manufacturer need to survive to allow the market to "figure it out"? And where does he get the money to do that? "The market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent" applies to more than just shorting stocks. That was the issue. The domestic manufacturers were going bankrupt waiting for the market to figure out that the Chinese cells would die prematurely. Of course, once all the domestic manufacturers are bankrupt, "the market" no longer matters because all you can get are the crappy Chinese cells.

bsder 9y ago

> Added to which the cheapest solar panels in China are often subjected a tariffs of up to 60%. Because they were both substandard and being dumped. And they drove a lot of reliable US manufacturers under. In addition, a LOT of installers went under because the warranty they offered assumed that they wouldn't have to show up again for 10 years. 3 years on they're getting warranty calls because the solar cells were failing. Of course, the Chinese manufacturer was nowhere to be found. There is a big difference between disposable electronics being too cheap and a capital expense being too cheap. Until US businesses can sue Chinese businesses for bad practices and win "the market" won't sort itself out. In the meantime, tariffs are a good working solution.

sqeaky 9y ago
The market figures this kind of stuff out. Reputable installers won't use the cheap cells and will warn their customers off the cheaper selling stuff that won't break in a few years. If the market couldn't things like double and triple pane windows wouldn't be able to out-compete single pane windows. We have done it with other goods too. American car companies got away with selling substandard stuff for a long time but revenues kept shrinking as Americans bought more foreign brands. It a major market disruption and a bailout for the car companies to right themselves. Sometimes it takes a while, sometimes a touch of government regulation makes it happen faster but when a business do shady stuff they punish themselves in the long run if there are legitimate options competing with them in the market.
- bsder 9y ago
  > The market figures this kind of stuff out. Reputable installers won't use the cheap cells and will warn their customers off the cheaper selling stuff that won't break in a few years. How many years does your reputable solar cell manufacturer need to survive to allow the market to "figure it out"? And where does he get the money to do that? "The market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent" applies to more than just shorting stocks. That was the issue. The domestic manufacturers were going bankrupt waiting for the market to figure out that the Chinese cells would die prematurely. Of course, once all the domestic manufacturers are bankrupt, "the market" no longer matters because all you can get are the crappy Chinese cells.