4 ms·

You can't get $10k to start a hot dog stand but you can get billions of dollars with literally no plan for profit if you're already rich or seeking VC. But want

You can't get $10k to start a hot dog stand but you can get billions of dollars with literally no plan for profit if you're already rich or seeking VC. But want to start a normal business? No capital for you! And your taxes will pay for the banks and VCs when they screw up.

balls187 9y ago
I get that this is hyperbole, but: 1. There are plenty of US Government (i.e. tax payer funded) programs to help people get "normal" ideas off the ground. From grants, to loans, the money is there. It's hard to imagine someone destined for success being stopped by not being able to raise $10k. $10k in credit card debt is nothing for the average american. 2. Success breeds success. If you're rich, you may already have your own skin in the game, or you may have proven yourself capable of using capital effectively.
- xiaoma 9y ago
  Since you seem knowledgeable about this, what is the amount of credit card debt available to the median American above what they already carry?
  - balls187 9y ago
    Above what they carry is irrelevant. American's can get themselves on average up to 5-7k of debt[1], it's reasonable assumption that if one was determined, they could get $10k in credit. https://www.valuepenguin.com/average-credit-card-debt https://www.valuepenguin.com/average-credit-card-debt
    - xiaoma 9y ago
      I can say from first-hand experience a few years ago that your assumption—which you presented as fact—is false.
- xenadu02 9y ago
  > 1. There are plenty of US Government (i.e. tax payer funded) programs to help people get "normal" ideas off the ground. From grants, to loans, the money is there. It's hard to imagine someone destined for success being stopped by not being able to raise $10k. $10k in credit card debt is nothing for the average american. You've obviously never tried this. It would be a full-time job for a year to even have a shot at these supposed grants. The money is absolutely not there the way you claim. The younger you are the less credit history you have which makes getting loans almost impossible unless you already have collateral to pledge against the loan. Oh and $10k is often not nearly enough capital to start a business since you need to pay your own bills while you bootstrap the business. We get away with it in tech often because we have the luxury of working after-hours as a side-project to start with. A customer-facing business can't do that.
  - balls187 9y ago
    > It would be a full-time job for a year to even have a shot at these supposed grants. How bad do you want to start a business? How long do you think startup founders work before having something that is worthy for seed funding?
- pnutjam 9y ago
  $10k would be life changing to many American familes.
venture_lol 9y ago
When companies hoard profits, they really serve no purpose and no-one but to perpetuate their control and to reduce and eliminate the ability of others to compete. The massive access to capital is akin to a super power. Well, superpower can be used by for better or for worse. Just as anti-trust laws are necessary, there will be drives for measures to encourage and even force companies to put their cash piles to use. Cash is the life of an economy, it needs to flow and flow.

balls187 9y ago

I get that this is hyperbole, but: 1. There are plenty of US Government (i.e. tax payer funded) programs to help people get "normal" ideas off the ground. From grants, to loans, the money is there. It's hard to imagine someone destined for success being stopped by not being able to raise $10k. $10k in credit card debt is nothing for the average american. 2. Success breeds success. If you're rich, you may already have your own skin in the game, or you may have proven yourself capable of using capital effectively.

xiaoma 9y ago
Since you seem knowledgeable about this, what is the amount of credit card debt available to the median American above what they already carry?
- balls187 9y ago
  Above what they carry is irrelevant. American's can get themselves on average up to 5-7k of debt[1], it's reasonable assumption that if one was determined, they could get $10k in credit. https://www.valuepenguin.com/average-credit-card-debt https://www.valuepenguin.com/average-credit-card-debt
  - xiaoma 9y ago
    I can say from first-hand experience a few years ago that your assumption—which you presented as fact—is false.
xenadu02 9y ago
> 1. There are plenty of US Government (i.e. tax payer funded) programs to help people get "normal" ideas off the ground. From grants, to loans, the money is there. It's hard to imagine someone destined for success being stopped by not being able to raise $10k. $10k in credit card debt is nothing for the average american. You've obviously never tried this. It would be a full-time job for a year to even have a shot at these supposed grants. The money is absolutely not there the way you claim. The younger you are the less credit history you have which makes getting loans almost impossible unless you already have collateral to pledge against the loan. Oh and $10k is often not nearly enough capital to start a business since you need to pay your own bills while you bootstrap the business. We get away with it in tech often because we have the luxury of working after-hours as a side-project to start with. A customer-facing business can't do that.
- balls187 9y ago
  > It would be a full-time job for a year to even have a shot at these supposed grants. How bad do you want to start a business? How long do you think startup founders work before having something that is worthy for seed funding?
pnutjam 9y ago
$10k would be life changing to many American familes.

venture_lol 9y ago

When companies hoard profits, they really serve no purpose and no-one but to perpetuate their control and to reduce and eliminate the ability of others to compete. The massive access to capital is akin to a super power. Well, superpower can be used by for better or for worse. Just as anti-trust laws are necessary, there will be drives for measures to encourage and even force companies to put their cash piles to use. Cash is the life of an economy, it needs to flow and flow.