4 ms·

Canadian province secretly passes law allowing arrest of those who won't show ID

20 points by mcantelon 16y ago

base 16y ago
in europe is the same. you always need to have the id with you.
- semanticist 16y ago
  Not everywhere - Europe is not homogeneous. There's no state-mandated ID in the UK, for example, so the police can't demand it here. In most circumstances you're not required to even disclose your name and address to a random plod.
  - zandorg 16y ago
    My rule of thumb is that any government proposing to introduce ID cards in the UK is about to lose the next election. It's happened twice (Conservatives in 1997, Labour in 2010).
    - RK 16y ago
      But those cameras are OK?
  - heresy 16y ago
    Calling the UK part of Europe is a stretch...
    - semanticist 16y ago
      It's really not. Is the UK more or less part of Europe than Norway (non-EU country), Poland (non-Euro country), or Ireland (non-Schengen country)?
fleitz 16y ago
Ihre Papiere, bitte!
jonnycowboy 16y ago
That's a pretty broad title... What the law actually changes is that if you're within 5 meters of the 'fence' surrounding the G20 zone, police have the right to ask you for ID and what you're doing there. If you don't show ID or answer their questions you are subject to arrest (but, as with this guy, probably no prosecution).
- WestCoastJustin 16y ago
  Totally agree. You have this guy (probably with his green bandanna over his face) while "exploring the G20 perimeter with his friend". Being passive aggressive landed him in jail but will probably have his court date dropped before July 28. Then again this appears to only be his side of the story. You want to bet that he was being a little more than passive aggressive ;) I don't really mind people who protest but I hate the fact that these yahoo fly into toronto just to stir shit up. Are they even hear for a cause for just to cause trouble? EDIT: added disclaimer: I tend to assume the worst in people ;)
  - mcantelon 16y ago
    Taking a sneering attitude towards people attempting to challenge security overreach doesn't serve the public interest. Being passive aggressive isn't against the law and if he was being more than passive aggressive (i.e. physically aggressive) the charges would likely reflect that.
  - mquander 16y ago
    This comment is unbelievably bad. What are you talking about, "probably with his green bandanna over his face?" Refusing to show ID is being "passive-aggressive?" I'd call it common sense (if you don't know that you're legally obligated to.) Either you have a lot of evidence that you're not telling us about, or you're casting aspersions onto this guy that are totally indefensible.
    - deleted 16y ago
      [deleted]
strebler 16y ago
Any details on this new law? Is it federal, provincial, temporary? A better story is the guy they stopped with a crossbow at the G20: http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/100624/national/g20_car_weapons http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/100624/national/g20_car_w...
- WestCoastJustin 16y ago
  Here is a very detailed article on the law: http://openfile.ca/toronto-file/g20-police-given-extra-powers http://openfile.ca/toronto-file/g20-police-given-extra-power... Public Works Protection Act: http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/statutes/english/elaws_statutes_90p55_e.htm http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/statutes/english/elaws_stat... Amendment: http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/source/regs/english/2010/elaws_src_regs_r10233_e.htm http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/source/regs/english/2010/el... Map of fence: http://www.g8-g20isu.ca/g20/resources/10-06-11-map.pdf http://www.g8-g20isu.ca/g20/resources/10-06-11-map.pdf
redstripe 16y ago
http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/statutes/english/elaws_statutes_90p55_e.htm http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/statutes/english/elaws_stat... - no idea if this is current or complete "A guard or peace officer, may require any person entering or attempting to enter any public work or any approach thereto to furnish his or her name and address, to identify himself or herself and to state the purpose for which he or she desires to enter the public work, in writing or otherwise;" I don't know what qualifies as "attempting to enter". Sounds arguable enough to be abused for this purpose though. Also I don't think a large part of the downtown core qualifies as a public work all of the sudden.
- what 16y ago
  I'm pretty sure it is current, and it's not new. I'm not sure why the submission title says anything about passing a new secret law.
stefanobernardi 16y ago
In most European countries you need to have your ID with you at all times and show it to the police upon request. I'm trying, but can't understand how it could be any different..

20 points by mcantelon 16y ago

base 16y ago

in europe is the same. you always need to have the id with you.

semanticist 16y ago
Not everywhere - Europe is not homogeneous. There's no state-mandated ID in the UK, for example, so the police can't demand it here. In most circumstances you're not required to even disclose your name and address to a random plod.
- zandorg 16y ago
  My rule of thumb is that any government proposing to introduce ID cards in the UK is about to lose the next election. It's happened twice (Conservatives in 1997, Labour in 2010).
  - RK 16y ago
    But those cameras are OK?
- heresy 16y ago
  Calling the UK part of Europe is a stretch...
  - semanticist 16y ago
    It's really not. Is the UK more or less part of Europe than Norway (non-EU country), Poland (non-Euro country), or Ireland (non-Schengen country)?

fleitz 16y ago

Ihre Papiere, bitte!

jonnycowboy 16y ago

That's a pretty broad title... What the law actually changes is that if you're within 5 meters of the 'fence' surrounding the G20 zone, police have the right to ask you for ID and what you're doing there. If you don't show ID or answer their questions you are subject to arrest (but, as with this guy, probably no prosecution).

WestCoastJustin 16y ago
Totally agree. You have this guy (probably with his green bandanna over his face) while "exploring the G20 perimeter with his friend". Being passive aggressive landed him in jail but will probably have his court date dropped before July 28. Then again this appears to only be his side of the story. You want to bet that he was being a little more than passive aggressive ;) I don't really mind people who protest but I hate the fact that these yahoo fly into toronto just to stir shit up. Are they even hear for a cause for just to cause trouble? EDIT: added disclaimer: I tend to assume the worst in people ;)
- mcantelon 16y ago
  Taking a sneering attitude towards people attempting to challenge security overreach doesn't serve the public interest. Being passive aggressive isn't against the law and if he was being more than passive aggressive (i.e. physically aggressive) the charges would likely reflect that.
- mquander 16y ago
  This comment is unbelievably bad. What are you talking about, "probably with his green bandanna over his face?" Refusing to show ID is being "passive-aggressive?" I'd call it common sense (if you don't know that you're legally obligated to.) Either you have a lot of evidence that you're not telling us about, or you're casting aspersions onto this guy that are totally indefensible.
  - deleted 16y ago
    [deleted]

strebler 16y ago

Any details on this new law? Is it federal, provincial, temporary? A better story is the guy they stopped with a crossbow at the G20: http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/100624/national/g20_car_weapons http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/100624/national/g20_car_w...

WestCoastJustin 16y ago
Here is a very detailed article on the law: http://openfile.ca/toronto-file/g20-police-given-extra-powers http://openfile.ca/toronto-file/g20-police-given-extra-power... Public Works Protection Act: http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/statutes/english/elaws_statutes_90p55_e.htm http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/statutes/english/elaws_stat... Amendment: http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/source/regs/english/2010/elaws_src_regs_r10233_e.htm http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/source/regs/english/2010/el... Map of fence: http://www.g8-g20isu.ca/g20/resources/10-06-11-map.pdf http://www.g8-g20isu.ca/g20/resources/10-06-11-map.pdf

redstripe 16y ago

http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/statutes/english/elaws_statutes_90p55_e.htm http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/statutes/english/elaws_stat... - no idea if this is current or complete "A guard or peace officer, may require any person entering or attempting to enter any public work or any approach thereto to furnish his or her name and address, to identify himself or herself and to state the purpose for which he or she desires to enter the public work, in writing or otherwise;" I don't know what qualifies as "attempting to enter". Sounds arguable enough to be abused for this purpose though. Also I don't think a large part of the downtown core qualifies as a public work all of the sudden.

what 16y ago
I'm pretty sure it is current, and it's not new. I'm not sure why the submission title says anything about passing a new secret law.

stefanobernardi 16y ago

In most European countries you need to have your ID with you at all times and show it to the police upon request. I'm trying, but can't understand how it could be any different..