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We (as a society) really need to be pushing more efficient water appliances. I looked up liters to gallons since I'm backwards and - in case anyone else is too

We (as a society) really need to be pushing more efficient water appliances. I looked up liters to gallons since I'm backwards and - in case anyone else is too - 10 liters is ~2.5 gallons. I replaced three toilest in my home that were flushing ~4 gallons with each flush with ones that flush with 1.28 gallons now. They are much more powerful than the previous ones I had, and use (liter-wise) less than half of the 10-liter mark. Do your efficient toilets overseas not get down to the 4-6 liter range per flush? The switch to more efficient toilets really made a big impact on my water bill for barely a dent to the wallet.

jacquesm 9y ago
How much do you pay for water? Did you calculate the pay-back time of those new toilets?
- refurb 9y ago
  Just as a reference point, in SF, the first three "units" of water (748 gallons), costs $6.42/unit. Or $0.009 per gallon. After that, $0.011 per gallon. That doesn't include things like delivery fees, sewer charges, etc.
- thatwebdude 9y ago
  No idea. I'm more about less waste though, so that and the home renovation was what sold me. Self-install so the cost was relatively low. http://www.hcsa.us/files/What-does-my-toilet-really-cost-me.pdf http://www.hcsa.us/files/What-does-my-toilet-really-cost-me....
nsxwolf 9y ago
Newer toilets in the US are only allowed 6 liters max.
- logfromblammo 9y ago
  And those toilets can never seem to handle my #2s. You're not saving anything if you have to flush 2-3 times and use a plunger every time. Regulating the volume of the tank is useless unless you also define a test standard for functionality. It's like saying that cars have to meet a minimum mileage standard without also specifying that they have to be able to maintain 60 mph while going up a 10% grade. Except in that situation, cars that do not meet the implicit minimum consumer standard don't get purchased off the lot. In houses, the person who buys the toilet is more likely planning to repackage it into an entire house and resell it to someone else than use it personally. So your toilet might look like a full-sized sedan, but have a go-kart engine under the hood. They just bolted a smaller tank onto a base that was designed for a larger flush volume. So what those toilets are allowed de jure is not necessarily lowering de facto water use. Yes, there are toilets out there that were redesigned for low flush volumes, and they do save water, but they have not displaced the letter-of-the-law, flush-it-twice toilets in the construction of cut-every-possible-corner suburban subdivisions.
  - veidr 9y ago
    So true! I rarely shit in US&A, but when I do, I must average close to 3 flushes per shit. I don't usually have to use a plunger (thankfully, since I don't live there and only shit there as a guest). But I've learned through hard experience: the Americans basically gave up on the toilet 100+ years ago. Cold as fuck porcelain, rarely a slow-seat-lowering mechanism, no stain-resistant adherence-resistant polymers, no way you're getting any heated seats or odor-suppressing intake fans than vent air through filters, and, for whatever reason (asshole/vagina-squeamish culture?) there are virtually no spraywash/bidet type features...and to add insult to injury they can't even reliably flush a man-size shit down !!! :-O I mean, they usually do, but any failure rate above 0.01% will make you quickly learn that you should just flush, then wipe, and if you feel like you need to wipe a bit extra this time, just flush again mid-wipe, and once more at the end. logfromblammo I am so utterly with you: flush-test the toilets (and fuck it, if we ban toilets that use too much water, we should ban toilets that can't reliably flush a heavy load). P.S. Yes, I live in Japan, the world's only toilet-superpower, and yes, I've ranted on this topic before on HN (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4787587 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4787587).
  - thatwebdude 9y ago
    The replacement toilets have never clogged, even with the entirety of a toilet paper roll being emptied into them (slight exaggeration). The lack of water in the bowl concerned me, but the "flushing power" makes up for it. I've had them installed for about two years now and the kids' toilets hasn't had anything that couldn't be flushed. But, as you mention, these aren't contractor-grade toilets. Indeed, those do suck. I've used plenty.
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
    - nsxwolf 9y ago
      There's definitely better and worse models. The ones the builder put in my house are pretty iffy. But the Eljer I put in my finished basement has never clogged.
  - 9y ago
- thatwebdude 9y ago
  Yes, and this is good. However, porcelain toilets kept in relatively good condition seem to last forever. The ones I was replacing were original to the home (30 years).
k_sze 9y ago
I remember living a month in Tokyo back in 2006 (or was it 2007). The house I shared had this toilet where the wash basin drained into the toilet tank. The faucet is activated when you flush the toilet. So once you're done with your #1 or #2, you wash your hands and the grey water is used to fill the tank. It was quite clever.

jacquesm 9y ago

How much do you pay for water? Did you calculate the pay-back time of those new toilets?

refurb 9y ago
Just as a reference point, in SF, the first three "units" of water (748 gallons), costs $6.42/unit. Or $0.009 per gallon. After that, $0.011 per gallon. That doesn't include things like delivery fees, sewer charges, etc.
thatwebdude 9y ago
No idea. I'm more about less waste though, so that and the home renovation was what sold me. Self-install so the cost was relatively low. http://www.hcsa.us/files/What-does-my-toilet-really-cost-me.pdf http://www.hcsa.us/files/What-does-my-toilet-really-cost-me....

nsxwolf 9y ago

Newer toilets in the US are only allowed 6 liters max.

logfromblammo 9y ago
And those toilets can never seem to handle my #2s. You're not saving anything if you have to flush 2-3 times and use a plunger every time. Regulating the volume of the tank is useless unless you also define a test standard for functionality. It's like saying that cars have to meet a minimum mileage standard without also specifying that they have to be able to maintain 60 mph while going up a 10% grade. Except in that situation, cars that do not meet the implicit minimum consumer standard don't get purchased off the lot. In houses, the person who buys the toilet is more likely planning to repackage it into an entire house and resell it to someone else than use it personally. So your toilet might look like a full-sized sedan, but have a go-kart engine under the hood. They just bolted a smaller tank onto a base that was designed for a larger flush volume. So what those toilets are allowed de jure is not necessarily lowering de facto water use. Yes, there are toilets out there that were redesigned for low flush volumes, and they do save water, but they have not displaced the letter-of-the-law, flush-it-twice toilets in the construction of cut-every-possible-corner suburban subdivisions.
- veidr 9y ago
  So true! I rarely shit in US&A, but when I do, I must average close to 3 flushes per shit. I don't usually have to use a plunger (thankfully, since I don't live there and only shit there as a guest). But I've learned through hard experience: the Americans basically gave up on the toilet 100+ years ago. Cold as fuck porcelain, rarely a slow-seat-lowering mechanism, no stain-resistant adherence-resistant polymers, no way you're getting any heated seats or odor-suppressing intake fans than vent air through filters, and, for whatever reason (asshole/vagina-squeamish culture?) there are virtually no spraywash/bidet type features...and to add insult to injury they can't even reliably flush a man-size shit down !!! :-O I mean, they usually do, but any failure rate above 0.01% will make you quickly learn that you should just flush, then wipe, and if you feel like you need to wipe a bit extra this time, just flush again mid-wipe, and once more at the end. logfromblammo I am so utterly with you: flush-test the toilets (and fuck it, if we ban toilets that use too much water, we should ban toilets that can't reliably flush a heavy load). P.S. Yes, I live in Japan, the world's only toilet-superpower, and yes, I've ranted on this topic before on HN (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4787587 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4787587).
- thatwebdude 9y ago
  The replacement toilets have never clogged, even with the entirety of a toilet paper roll being emptied into them (slight exaggeration). The lack of water in the bowl concerned me, but the "flushing power" makes up for it. I've had them installed for about two years now and the kids' toilets hasn't had anything that couldn't be flushed. But, as you mention, these aren't contractor-grade toilets. Indeed, those do suck. I've used plenty.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - nsxwolf 9y ago
    There's definitely better and worse models. The ones the builder put in my house are pretty iffy. But the Eljer I put in my finished basement has never clogged.
- 9y ago
thatwebdude 9y ago
Yes, and this is good. However, porcelain toilets kept in relatively good condition seem to last forever. The ones I was replacing were original to the home (30 years).

k_sze 9y ago

I remember living a month in Tokyo back in 2006 (or was it 2007). The house I shared had this toilet where the wash basin drained into the toilet tank. The faucet is activated when you flush the toilet. So once you're done with your #1 or #2, you wash your hands and the grey water is used to fill the tank. It was quite clever.