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>You can build a mutable payment system on top of an immutable blockchain Can you do this without centralization? >Without immutability, the blockchain will e

>You can build a mutable payment system on top of an immutable blockchain Can you do this without centralization? >Without immutability, the blockchain will eventually lose all of its differentiating features, and have no value proposition. Right my point is though that for most people immutability ISN'T actually a value proposition. It's a risk.

Jabanga 9y ago
>Can you do this without centralization? No, this is a service of centralized parties, which are free to use the blockchain. My point is that an immutable blockchain can have both mutable and immutable services, while a mutable blockchain can only have mutable services. The immutable blockchain therefore has a major competitive advantage over the mutable one. With respect to immutability, it is important for some critical applications, like money in countries that restrict economic rights. If you live in Venezuela for example, you will not want your wealth in the form of a digital currency that's stored on the servers of a company in another country, because that server could eventually be shutdown, or have its ledger altered by the trusted third party running it. Your government is a powerful organization after all, and could lobby the government of the country where the server is held to force the company to restrict people from your country from using its banking services. Or that country may try to punish your country's government, by sanctioning all Venezuelan nationals, which again would lead to you losing access to the ledger. You want you wealth in the form of a digital currency sitting in a decentralized network that maintains an immutable ledger.
- sanswork 9y ago
  If you're building a service on top that is centralized why bother with the overhead of a decentralized service below? If you live in a country like Venezuela couldn't they just shut down the internet and make your savings worthless overnight?
  - Jabanga 9y ago
    In many cases you wouldn't bother with the overhead, you're right. I imagine there will be situations where having some elements of the business on the blockchain, and having some off-chain and centralized would be optimal. Regarding Venezuela, there may be situations where the government is willing to shut down your bank account or prohibit meatspace financial institutions from letting you as the client use other currencies, but isn't willing to go as far as shutting down the internet. So in that scenario, an immutable ledger would have value. Also while the Venezuelan government may be able to prevent you from accessing the rest of the global internet, it can't shut the global internet down. So as soon as you leave Venezuela, you can regain access to your savings.

Jabanga 9y ago

>Can you do this without centralization? No, this is a service of centralized parties, which are free to use the blockchain. My point is that an immutable blockchain can have both mutable and immutable services, while a mutable blockchain can only have mutable services. The immutable blockchain therefore has a major competitive advantage over the mutable one. With respect to immutability, it is important for some critical applications, like money in countries that restrict economic rights. If you live in Venezuela for example, you will not want your wealth in the form of a digital currency that's stored on the servers of a company in another country, because that server could eventually be shutdown, or have its ledger altered by the trusted third party running it. Your government is a powerful organization after all, and could lobby the government of the country where the server is held to force the company to restrict people from your country from using its banking services. Or that country may try to punish your country's government, by sanctioning all Venezuelan nationals, which again would lead to you losing access to the ledger. You want you wealth in the form of a digital currency sitting in a decentralized network that maintains an immutable ledger.

sanswork 9y ago
If you're building a service on top that is centralized why bother with the overhead of a decentralized service below? If you live in a country like Venezuela couldn't they just shut down the internet and make your savings worthless overnight?
- Jabanga 9y ago
  In many cases you wouldn't bother with the overhead, you're right. I imagine there will be situations where having some elements of the business on the blockchain, and having some off-chain and centralized would be optimal. Regarding Venezuela, there may be situations where the government is willing to shut down your bank account or prohibit meatspace financial institutions from letting you as the client use other currencies, but isn't willing to go as far as shutting down the internet. So in that scenario, an immutable ledger would have value. Also while the Venezuelan government may be able to prevent you from accessing the rest of the global internet, it can't shut the global internet down. So as soon as you leave Venezuela, you can regain access to your savings.