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I don't understand the distinction you are drawing. The original iPhone, with the addition of a usable web browser, was a general purpose computer in my mind.

I don't understand the distinction you are drawing. The original iPhone, with the addition of a usable web browser, was a general purpose computer in my mind. Would you not call a ChromeBook a general purpose computer? I realize there is a contingent on HN who doesn't consider a browser to be a valid virtual machine, and doesn't consider anything a real computer unless they have access to a command prompt. But that's a religious conviction, I don't see any principled difference. Let me put it this way: the original iPhone, with only mobile Safari, was a more powerful machine in every way than every computer I owned up to probably 1999 or so, with the exception of screen size. What am I missing?

khedoros1 9y ago
The hardware is clearly that of a "general purpose computer". The OS and software was/is limited in ways that make me think more of an appliance, though. A complicated, customizable, but purposely limited appliance. I can write a Javascript program, stick it on a web server, and load it in the phone's browser. Why can't I edit it on the phone and just run the program from disk? If I wanted to do so, how would I write a program to let me? I think the core limitations for me are that I don't have direct access to the filesystem, I don't have access to the APIs required to program the device for things that I consider basic capabilities, and the vendor actively fights me being able to do those things. Any holes that they don't hit with OS and API limitations get caught during the app review when you're going to publish your code. Compare to a Chromebook: There's a Google-provided dev mode that lets me install an OS of my choice, and a chroot environment developed by a Google engineer that gives me access to an unrestricted OS running simultaneously on the machine. The command prompt's moot; one could theoretically write a GUI for anything and everything that it provides. The browser's "a valid virtual machine", but there are limitations of what I can do with JS, where I can host it to run the programs, and so on. My 1st gen iPod Touch was cool after I jailbroke it (kind of a wifi-enabled single-board computer). I used to run sshd and rtorrent, and had Perl and a C compiler on it. I do similar things on my Android device running its stock OS.
bipson 9y ago
I clearly presented my argument badly. I was not aiming for the general purpose computer part, but the suggested notion that the now clearly visible impact of the iPhone was intended just that way, as its main purpose, its this-is-all-or-nothing goal. Steve Jobs and Apple in the 200x years clearly were amazing and did wonderful things, but they did not read the future, they went step by step and built on top of what they had. Some things fell into place, some things went different than expected. I can't prove it, but the shift in how we use our phones nowadays was as visible to Steve Jobs as it was to almost anyone in that field. There were predecessors. Multiple. The goal of the iPhone was to sell things, millions if possible. Everything else was in the range of: "Let's see".

khedoros1 9y ago

The hardware is clearly that of a "general purpose computer". The OS and software was/is limited in ways that make me think more of an appliance, though. A complicated, customizable, but purposely limited appliance. I can write a Javascript program, stick it on a web server, and load it in the phone's browser. Why can't I edit it on the phone and just run the program from disk? If I wanted to do so, how would I write a program to let me? I think the core limitations for me are that I don't have direct access to the filesystem, I don't have access to the APIs required to program the device for things that I consider basic capabilities, and the vendor actively fights me being able to do those things. Any holes that they don't hit with OS and API limitations get caught during the app review when you're going to publish your code. Compare to a Chromebook: There's a Google-provided dev mode that lets me install an OS of my choice, and a chroot environment developed by a Google engineer that gives me access to an unrestricted OS running simultaneously on the machine. The command prompt's moot; one could theoretically write a GUI for anything and everything that it provides. The browser's "a valid virtual machine", but there are limitations of what I can do with JS, where I can host it to run the programs, and so on. My 1st gen iPod Touch was cool after I jailbroke it (kind of a wifi-enabled single-board computer). I used to run sshd and rtorrent, and had Perl and a C compiler on it. I do similar things on my Android device running its stock OS.

bipson 9y ago

I clearly presented my argument badly. I was not aiming for the general purpose computer part, but the suggested notion that the now clearly visible impact of the iPhone was intended just that way, as its main purpose, its this-is-all-or-nothing goal. Steve Jobs and Apple in the 200x years clearly were amazing and did wonderful things, but they did not read the future, they went step by step and built on top of what they had. Some things fell into place, some things went different than expected. I can't prove it, but the shift in how we use our phones nowadays was as visible to Steve Jobs as it was to almost anyone in that field. There were predecessors. Multiple. The goal of the iPhone was to sell things, millions if possible. Everything else was in the range of: "Let's see".