4 ms·

They took care of him after the incident that caused brain damage, but is there any proof the incident itself was botulism?

jk2323 9y ago
No. We don't know what happened. I am not an MD. I am sure there are many options what could happened. But the way he was taken care of and returned (they could have claimed he died) seems to suggest that he was not put into this condition on purpose.
- lern_too_spel 9y ago
  He was only returned after the Swedish embassy learned about his condition. He had already been in a coma for a year by then and would have stayed in the DPRK for the remainder of his sentence otherwise. If they claimed that a man in his twenties had died of a heart attack as they did with Japanese citizens they abducted, that would have been an even bigger scandal.
auganov 9y ago
His doctors say the pattern of brain damage does not match that of botulism. More symptomatic of a respiratory arrest. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJKmyCKM7W0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJKmyCKM7W0
- shovelingstuff 9y ago
  The pattern of brain injury they're referring to is probably "anoxic brain injury." Botulism itself doesn't cause that, but it certainly can cause respiratory failure (by paralyzing the phrenic nerve), which can then cause anoxic brain injury. There's no reliable way to tell at this point whether botulism was the cause in Warmbier's case (there's no test to find out after the fact). I'm an MD. Of course the NK story is very suspect. We need more information, but it seems unlikely that we'll get it.
  - dmix 9y ago
    We're sure that he wasn't because he was beaten though, right? There hasn't been any US prisoners in NK who were physically abused during their stay for PR purposes. I'm curious if he sustained a fall or some other accidental injury. Maybe he caused it himself and didn't get proper treatment. He was held for an unusually long time compared to most people.

jk2323 9y ago

No. We don't know what happened. I am not an MD. I am sure there are many options what could happened. But the way he was taken care of and returned (they could have claimed he died) seems to suggest that he was not put into this condition on purpose.

lern_too_spel 9y ago
He was only returned after the Swedish embassy learned about his condition. He had already been in a coma for a year by then and would have stayed in the DPRK for the remainder of his sentence otherwise. If they claimed that a man in his twenties had died of a heart attack as they did with Japanese citizens they abducted, that would have been an even bigger scandal.

auganov 9y ago

His doctors say the pattern of brain damage does not match that of botulism. More symptomatic of a respiratory arrest. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJKmyCKM7W0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJKmyCKM7W0

shovelingstuff 9y ago
The pattern of brain injury they're referring to is probably "anoxic brain injury." Botulism itself doesn't cause that, but it certainly can cause respiratory failure (by paralyzing the phrenic nerve), which can then cause anoxic brain injury. There's no reliable way to tell at this point whether botulism was the cause in Warmbier's case (there's no test to find out after the fact). I'm an MD. Of course the NK story is very suspect. We need more information, but it seems unlikely that we'll get it.
- dmix 9y ago
  We're sure that he wasn't because he was beaten though, right? There hasn't been any US prisoners in NK who were physically abused during their stay for PR purposes. I'm curious if he sustained a fall or some other accidental injury. Maybe he caused it himself and didn't get proper treatment. He was held for an unusually long time compared to most people.