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Without source code that seems like all smoke and mirrors to me. I'd love it if they released it, and I'd start buying their stuff immediately. But until they

Without source code that seems like all smoke and mirrors to me. I'd love it if they released it, and I'd start buying their stuff immediately. But until they put their money where there mouth is... meh

natch 9y ago
No need to be snide about it. Of course they aren't going to open source the entire OS. Just like Google hasn't open sourced all of Android. They always hold something back. And you're commenting on an article where the maintainer has said that open source is "coming in the future." In the meantime: https://opensource.apple.com https://opensource.apple.com https://github.com/apple https://github.com/apple http://llvm.org http://llvm.org https://swift.org https://swift.org https://developer.apple.com/opensource/ https://developer.apple.com/opensource/ I think it's safe to say they are betting the company on this, and putting plenty of money into it. And far from being smoke and mirrors vaporware, this is hardware and software that you can hold in your hand and use and rely on, and millions of people do, every day.
- CaptSpify 9y ago
  I'm not sure how my comment is "snide". It's just a fact: I don't trust them. And I don't see how Google is relevant to the conversation. They don't release source, so I'm not really interested in their products either. Just because one company is does things in a way I don't like doesn't mean I have to accept it when others do it that way. "coming in the future" is nice, but I've heard that speech before, and I'm not holding my breath. If they are betting the company on this, then great! I'll put a lot of money into their products. But until they do, meh, I'm not interested. And by smoke and mirrors I don't mean vapor-ware, I mean distracting from the real issues, and hiding their flaws instead of fixing them.
  - natch 9y ago
    Well, you are making assumptions from ignorance. You don't have to hold your breath. I gave you the links. The open source is already there. Breathe. And you seriously think Apple is not fixing flaws? Watch their WWDC sessions. They have fixed tons of flaws. Your hate is showing through. Maybe set aside your feelings once in a while and look at the facts.
    - CaptSpify 9y ago
      I really don't think I understand what you mean. Those links are some open source stuff that they've done. Great. That's not the OS, nor the apps. I want them to open source the OS and their apps. I'm sure they are fixing security flaws, but they are still not addressing the underlying issue. I like what they say their philosophy is, but until they open source all their stuff, I have no reason to trust them. I definitely hate them, because I really want a company like them to succeed. But they refuse to put their money where their mouth is. I'd invite you to point me to any facts that I've missed, but I don't see where I've missed any.
      - natch 9y ago
        Let me know when you've watched their WWDC talks from this year on privacy and security. Especially privacy. You could do previous years too and those would be complementary, not redundant, but that's quite a time commitment and a lot to ask. Just this year's would be a really great start. Then I'd love to hear what you think after that. Yeah they won't be completely open source any time soon, that's a nice dream, lol. But imho you should open your mind to learning about what they are doing now, before being so negative and down on them.
        CaptSpify 9y ago
        > Let me know when you've watched their WWDC talks from this year on privacy and security. Especially privacy. Nope, not going to. Frankly it's a waste of my time because I'm not going to buy their product. They can say nice things on a stage all they want, but until they open source it, then I really don't care. If they open-source it, then I would buy their products in a heartbeat. You say it's a nice dream, I say it's reality. I have a laptop/desktop system that works great and is FOSS. I don't see how phones or any other computerized device is any different. None of it matters until they put their money where there mouth is. I'm only being negative towards them because they refuse to fully commit to what they preach. I find nothing wrong with that, and frankly, I don't get how other people don't have a problem with that.
        9y ago

natch 9y ago

No need to be snide about it. Of course they aren't going to open source the entire OS. Just like Google hasn't open sourced all of Android. They always hold something back. And you're commenting on an article where the maintainer has said that open source is "coming in the future." In the meantime: https://opensource.apple.com https://opensource.apple.com https://github.com/apple https://github.com/apple http://llvm.org http://llvm.org https://swift.org https://swift.org https://developer.apple.com/opensource/ https://developer.apple.com/opensource/ I think it's safe to say they are betting the company on this, and putting plenty of money into it. And far from being smoke and mirrors vaporware, this is hardware and software that you can hold in your hand and use and rely on, and millions of people do, every day.

CaptSpify 9y ago
I'm not sure how my comment is "snide". It's just a fact: I don't trust them. And I don't see how Google is relevant to the conversation. They don't release source, so I'm not really interested in their products either. Just because one company is does things in a way I don't like doesn't mean I have to accept it when others do it that way. "coming in the future" is nice, but I've heard that speech before, and I'm not holding my breath. If they are betting the company on this, then great! I'll put a lot of money into their products. But until they do, meh, I'm not interested. And by smoke and mirrors I don't mean vapor-ware, I mean distracting from the real issues, and hiding their flaws instead of fixing them.
- natch 9y ago
  Well, you are making assumptions from ignorance. You don't have to hold your breath. I gave you the links. The open source is already there. Breathe. And you seriously think Apple is not fixing flaws? Watch their WWDC sessions. They have fixed tons of flaws. Your hate is showing through. Maybe set aside your feelings once in a while and look at the facts.
  - CaptSpify 9y ago
    I really don't think I understand what you mean. Those links are some open source stuff that they've done. Great. That's not the OS, nor the apps. I want them to open source the OS and their apps. I'm sure they are fixing security flaws, but they are still not addressing the underlying issue. I like what they say their philosophy is, but until they open source all their stuff, I have no reason to trust them. I definitely hate them, because I really want a company like them to succeed. But they refuse to put their money where their mouth is. I'd invite you to point me to any facts that I've missed, but I don't see where I've missed any.
    - natch 9y ago
      Let me know when you've watched their WWDC talks from this year on privacy and security. Especially privacy. You could do previous years too and those would be complementary, not redundant, but that's quite a time commitment and a lot to ask. Just this year's would be a really great start. Then I'd love to hear what you think after that. Yeah they won't be completely open source any time soon, that's a nice dream, lol. But imho you should open your mind to learning about what they are doing now, before being so negative and down on them.
      - CaptSpify 9y ago
        > Let me know when you've watched their WWDC talks from this year on privacy and security. Especially privacy. Nope, not going to. Frankly it's a waste of my time because I'm not going to buy their product. They can say nice things on a stage all they want, but until they open source it, then I really don't care. If they open-source it, then I would buy their products in a heartbeat. You say it's a nice dream, I say it's reality. I have a laptop/desktop system that works great and is FOSS. I don't see how phones or any other computerized device is any different. None of it matters until they put their money where there mouth is. I'm only being negative towards them because they refuse to fully commit to what they preach. I find nothing wrong with that, and frankly, I don't get how other people don't have a problem with that.
        9y ago