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How about reform? Revolutions have never worked. They just lead to more violence. I think the problem is that there are too many problems in the US and people

How about reform? Revolutions have never worked. They just lead to more violence. I think the problem is that there are too many problems in the US and people focus on too many issues rather than focusing on the underlying issues. Little can happen until the election system is changed. Hence one needs to vote in politicians who will change it. To make that happen more young people and minorities need to vote. That means whatever you think of prison systems, or anything else, getting more people to vote is number one priority. What people don't get is that, by merely voting you can make a change even if the choices are shit. If politicians knew lots of young and minorities tended to vote, then the politicians would start attempting to take advantage of that and push issues these groups care about.

TylerE 9y ago
> Revolutions have never worked I suspect the French would disagree. Also, we haven't exactly been paying tea tax to Britain for the last 230-odd years either, for that matter.
- dragonwriter 9y ago
  > > Revolutions have never worked > I suspect the French would disagree. France (and particularly the 1789 and 1848 revolutions) is pretty much the first example people making that claim point to. (Though I suppose you can make a case that the 1848 revolution worked, it just faced an extended counterrevolutionary setback in the form of the Second Empire.) > Also, we haven't exactly been paying tea tax to Britain for the last 230-odd years either, for that matter. Regional separatist movements are a different thing than revolutions, even if one of the latter gets named as if it were the former.
anigbrowl 9y ago
I think you'll find that most Americans think one particular revolution worked really well. So do most people who live in countries that gained independence from colonialism, and the French have practically made it a way of life (that's a joke, OK). Reform and incrementalism are great when there's a broad institutional consensus, but when institutions are widely considered to be corrupt then a rewrite may be better than a refactor. The downsides of revolution are obvious: chaos, violence, unpredictability. But if one honestly accounts for the institutionalized versions in which those conditions are systemically imposed upon unwilling participants, the inevitable conclusion is that social upheaval and a reboot are a price that is sometimes worth paying. Insofar as enough people feel they have nothing to lose, the economic incentives make it inevitable.

TylerE 9y ago

> Revolutions have never worked I suspect the French would disagree. Also, we haven't exactly been paying tea tax to Britain for the last 230-odd years either, for that matter.

dragonwriter 9y ago
> > Revolutions have never worked > I suspect the French would disagree. France (and particularly the 1789 and 1848 revolutions) is pretty much the first example people making that claim point to. (Though I suppose you can make a case that the 1848 revolution worked, it just faced an extended counterrevolutionary setback in the form of the Second Empire.) > Also, we haven't exactly been paying tea tax to Britain for the last 230-odd years either, for that matter. Regional separatist movements are a different thing than revolutions, even if one of the latter gets named as if it were the former.

anigbrowl 9y ago

I think you'll find that most Americans think one particular revolution worked really well. So do most people who live in countries that gained independence from colonialism, and the French have practically made it a way of life (that's a joke, OK). Reform and incrementalism are great when there's a broad institutional consensus, but when institutions are widely considered to be corrupt then a rewrite may be better than a refactor. The downsides of revolution are obvious: chaos, violence, unpredictability. But if one honestly accounts for the institutionalized versions in which those conditions are systemically imposed upon unwilling participants, the inevitable conclusion is that social upheaval and a reboot are a price that is sometimes worth paying. Insofar as enough people feel they have nothing to lose, the economic incentives make it inevitable.