3 ms·

I'm sympathetic to your pov, but those big traumatic events likely left huge scars on the psyche of the previous generations. The PTSD was not being diagnosed a

by DenisM 9y ago

I'm sympathetic to your pov, but those big traumatic events likely left huge scars on the psyche of the previous generations. The PTSD was not being diagnosed at the time. Big struggle may not be the recipe for mental health.

maxxxxx 9y ago
Totally agree. Many WW2 probably had serious PTSD. My point is that people who haven't gone though serious struggle tend to "sweat the small stuff". When I hear people being crazy angry and depressed about the Trump election it seems it me that they are looking for a mission in life. Modern corporate life doesn't offer a meaningful mission so they go overboard with politics or something else really not that important.
- pas 9y ago
  Exactly, except it's just as important. You know, there were probably a lot of Germans in 1930 going overboard with politics, yet Hitler got elected. Bad politics was bad politics back then, and it's bad now, and it's good that there are people trying to lift the quality and substance of political discourse. Even if it means spending weeks debunking clueless, loud and aggressive ignoramuses; going to rallies, writing to reps and senators and so on. Maybe, as the folks back then weren't too effective, the folks nowadays might be not very effective either, but that doesn't mean the problems are less important. For example, there are more people now that in the 1940s, and a lot more pollution, and so more people die thanks to pollution than back then, so if you can persuade others to help curb pollution, you help saving millions of people. The same thing goes for other aspects of life. And yes, people are bad at appreciating the paperpusher numbercruncher aspect of change, and naturally feel the awe and the epicness of a world war. And the same way a war affects millions a financial crisis, a flood or drought, or an epidemic does too, yet one is a lot more palpable, with good and bad actors, with bad guys to shoot at. Another interesting aspect is how people treat refugees and civilians (interment of Japanese, sending back Cubans, now the handling of Syrians) which again is a lot less glorious than a world war, but potentially (and likely) affects a lot more people.
  - maxxxxx 9y ago
    To me the current political debate in the US is just manufactured theater to keep the people busy arguing about unimportant things. No real issues are being discussed, no path forward for the country. It's just "You are bad. No, YOU are bad". I have no idea what the Democrats stand for otherwise than maintaining the status quo and the Republicans just want to make sure that the upper class gets richer. And the electoral system doesn't allow anyone with new ideas to come up.
    - foldr 9y ago
      Unimportant things like climate change and affordable health care? You can't say that now that Trump is President and is making important changes that Clinton wouldn't have made.
    - pas 9y ago
      Well, yes, if you watch "news". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fKsBj2M-T8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fKsBj2M-T8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pS4x8hXQ5c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pS4x8hXQ5c But there are real issues voted on. And even if there's no clear path forward, it's important to not go backward! > It's just "You are bad. No, YOU are bad" And? It's how ideas are criticized - ideally, by pointing out the errors in them. If someone uses ad hominem arguments, maybe try to find better people to listen to? (Economists, sociologists, policy scholars?) > And the electoral system doesn't allow anyone with new ideas to come up. Then don't spend time on those things, spend time on election reform, look at where those are, look at interesting things that matter and that help predict the world. https://www.top500.org/news/can-a-supercomputing-algorithm-kill-gerrymanding/ https://www.top500.org/news/can-a-supercomputing-algorithm-k... https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/why-the-best-supreme-court-predictor-in-the-world-is-some-random-guy-in-queens/ https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/why-the-best-supreme-co... So, the debate is what you make it to be.

by DenisM 9y ago

maxxxxx 9y ago

Totally agree. Many WW2 probably had serious PTSD. My point is that people who haven't gone though serious struggle tend to "sweat the small stuff". When I hear people being crazy angry and depressed about the Trump election it seems it me that they are looking for a mission in life. Modern corporate life doesn't offer a meaningful mission so they go overboard with politics or something else really not that important.

pas 9y ago
Exactly, except it's just as important. You know, there were probably a lot of Germans in 1930 going overboard with politics, yet Hitler got elected. Bad politics was bad politics back then, and it's bad now, and it's good that there are people trying to lift the quality and substance of political discourse. Even if it means spending weeks debunking clueless, loud and aggressive ignoramuses; going to rallies, writing to reps and senators and so on. Maybe, as the folks back then weren't too effective, the folks nowadays might be not very effective either, but that doesn't mean the problems are less important. For example, there are more people now that in the 1940s, and a lot more pollution, and so more people die thanks to pollution than back then, so if you can persuade others to help curb pollution, you help saving millions of people. The same thing goes for other aspects of life. And yes, people are bad at appreciating the paperpusher numbercruncher aspect of change, and naturally feel the awe and the epicness of a world war. And the same way a war affects millions a financial crisis, a flood or drought, or an epidemic does too, yet one is a lot more palpable, with good and bad actors, with bad guys to shoot at. Another interesting aspect is how people treat refugees and civilians (interment of Japanese, sending back Cubans, now the handling of Syrians) which again is a lot less glorious than a world war, but potentially (and likely) affects a lot more people.
- maxxxxx 9y ago
  To me the current political debate in the US is just manufactured theater to keep the people busy arguing about unimportant things. No real issues are being discussed, no path forward for the country. It's just "You are bad. No, YOU are bad". I have no idea what the Democrats stand for otherwise than maintaining the status quo and the Republicans just want to make sure that the upper class gets richer. And the electoral system doesn't allow anyone with new ideas to come up.
  - foldr 9y ago
    Unimportant things like climate change and affordable health care? You can't say that now that Trump is President and is making important changes that Clinton wouldn't have made.
  - pas 9y ago
    Well, yes, if you watch "news". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fKsBj2M-T8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fKsBj2M-T8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pS4x8hXQ5c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pS4x8hXQ5c But there are real issues voted on. And even if there's no clear path forward, it's important to not go backward! > It's just "You are bad. No, YOU are bad" And? It's how ideas are criticized - ideally, by pointing out the errors in them. If someone uses ad hominem arguments, maybe try to find better people to listen to? (Economists, sociologists, policy scholars?) > And the electoral system doesn't allow anyone with new ideas to come up. Then don't spend time on those things, spend time on election reform, look at where those are, look at interesting things that matter and that help predict the world. https://www.top500.org/news/can-a-supercomputing-algorithm-kill-gerrymanding/ https://www.top500.org/news/can-a-supercomputing-algorithm-k... https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/why-the-best-supreme-court-predictor-in-the-world-is-some-random-guy-in-queens/ https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/why-the-best-supreme-co... So, the debate is what you make it to be.