9 ms·

Ok, but what about the other 99% of the population who are too busy to completely learn ops and opsec? My mom isn't going to leave facebook to make her own webs

Ok, but what about the other 99% of the population who are too busy to completely learn ops and opsec? My mom isn't going to leave facebook to make her own website and host her own email, even if you give her all the tutorials in the world.

sjg007 9y ago
Website in a box (docker), put it wherever. This might be a good idea.
- thoaionline 9y ago
  That's a fine business idea.
- kakarot 9y ago
  I like the idea, but the goal would be to make configuration, deployment, maintenance, and good security as easy as possible. So easy that you don't have to touch a command line. Mind expanding on the idea a bit?
  - zakki 9y ago
    I think It is time to reinstate geocities.
    - livingparadox 9y ago
      You might be interested in its spiritual successor neocities, then https://neocities.org/ https://neocities.org/
      - kyledrake 9y ago
        And the founder of Neocities thinks it's time to instate a distributed web https://blog.neocities.org/blog/2015/09/08/its-time-for-the-distributed-web.html https://blog.neocities.org/blog/2015/09/08/its-time-for-the-...
        it_learnses 9y ago
        ok how will neocities or anybody hosting a node be compensated? How will the artists whose works are being distributed in this manner be compensated?
        thatcat 9y ago
        They probably won't, but could by using a distributed pay to host service like filecoin https://filecoin.io/ https://filecoin.io/
        kyledrake 9y ago
        How sites would make money? I'm not really thinking about that too much right now, but I suppose sites could do all the usual things they do with the current web (advertising, accepting payments via credit card gateways, Bitcoin, Patreon, etc). It doesn't have to be an all-or-nothing proposition and it certainly isn't to me. Some functionality will still require a centralized service, just not the entire thing.
        mcbits 9y ago
        With some sort of "proof of upstream" cryptocurrency that trickles a percentage back to the content's origin node along with other nodes in between. Users would earn credits by leaving their devices connected and forwarding data, paying most of it back into the network when downloading data. The original uploaders of very popular content would accumulate a surplus of credits, which they then sell to to mega-crawlers. Content creators would do well to be the original uploaders of their own content on such a network. The credits would also be incentive to buy devices and leave them running in poor-coverage areas. E.g. the owners of billboards could mount repeaters along rural highways.
- davidcbc 9y ago
  Why would my mother do that instead of just using Facebook which is already there and already had all of her friends and family on it?
  - mirimir 9y ago
    Because maybe Facebook nukes her account, for whatever reason.
    - StephenConnell 9y ago
      I am an advocate of having your own domain and having control. But most people don't care as much as the hacker news crowd does. "Phone broke, here is my new number..." really? For business it's critical to maintain any form of communication you have ever offered. But for personal, a lot of people don't care if they change their [email] and inconvenience their friends and family. The internet is not crucial to everyones daily life. And honestly, it probably shouldn't be as crucial to ours.
    - nextlevelwizard 9y ago
      When has this actually happened? And by this I mean that out of nowhere Facebook suddenly has deleted someone's page and then not restored it? I get what you are suggesting, but I can't help but to think you are making this way bigger issue than it actually is. Also all of you are missing the most obvious point: if it hasn't happened to a lot (and I mean literally more than 10-20% of user base) it is not a significant risk and thus spending extra effort for literally no gain (and actually probably more of a loss in views/users/buyers/whatever) is not worth paying someone to design you a website and paying for updates and then A) paying for (yet another) 3rd party company to host your website B) learning how to setup, host, update, and maintain your own website. I'm sure most of people on this site could easily setup their own website and run it wherever, but the reason why people are paying you to do such things for living means that most people can't be bothered to learn all the necessary skills.
      - interfixus 9y ago
- synicalx 9y ago
  So, Wordpress basically?
- JustSomeNobody 9y ago
  Yes. But by website in a box, it would have to be as dirt simple as signing up for FB. So, gramma goes to a web page, clicks the signup, the website deploys a docker image on a webhost and spins up a UI that is not unlike what she is already used to. Next, comment and "likes". You have to have a comment system that runs on there also. Gramma would invite others to her site by clicking invite. This would generate a specific invite signature for that person and would email it out (gramma would need to know Uncle Fred's email; sorry gramma). Uncle Fred would click the link and be taken to gramma's sight and can comment. All comments stay on gramma's sight. All gramma's content, period, stay's on gramma's sight. How does one monetize, however?
  - gagege 9y ago
    To monetize you could make referral deals with web hosts. I assume this setup means that gramma is paying the web host a fee.
  - piaste 9y ago
    There are some docker images on DockerHub which are very polished along those lines. OwnCloud for storage, Ghost for blogging. You run them with default settings and they open to a nice welcome page with a tutorial and a fully-functional setup. With a docker UI like Kitematic, it's remarkably similar to an app store experience.
andrewwharton 9y ago
No one said anything about hosting your own email or making your own website. eg. My wife has a small business with an online store hosted on Shopify and her email provider is Gmail. But her website is www.her_domain.com and her email address is @her_domain.com. She can easily switch out her providers and her contact addresses don't change. No real tech knowledge needed except for how to register a domain name and follow some how-to docs from Shopify and Gmail.
- nitemice 9y ago
  I think this is the right attitude to take. It strikes the perfect balance between offloading your problems to the big guys, and keeping control if they decide to screw you over, or run off into the wild yonder. That doesn't mean they couldn't still mess you up pretty bad. You'd want a pretty solid backup scheme, and you'll still have to accept the loss of some levels of privacy etc. but that might be worth it to you to subsidise cheap services, while still having an escape plan.
  - fivestar 9y ago
    They're already screwing us over--they took sides in the election and modified/molded content and search results in an attempt to push their agenda. That was evil.
- davidcbc 9y ago
  Registering a domain name may as well be magic to a large portion of the population.
  - Spivak 9y ago
    The process of registering the domain behind the scenes might be a bit magic but buying one and pointing it at a hosting provider certainly isn't.
    - mcbits 9y ago
      You're ignoring (or overestimating) the enormous segment of the population who wouldn't even have an Internet presence if it didn't come with the phone, and getting the phone was already the one of the most mentally challenging things they've done in years.

sjg007 9y ago

Website in a box (docker), put it wherever. This might be a good idea.

thoaionline 9y ago
That's a fine business idea.
kakarot 9y ago
I like the idea, but the goal would be to make configuration, deployment, maintenance, and good security as easy as possible. So easy that you don't have to touch a command line. Mind expanding on the idea a bit?
- zakki 9y ago
  I think It is time to reinstate geocities.
  - livingparadox 9y ago
    You might be interested in its spiritual successor neocities, then https://neocities.org/ https://neocities.org/
    - kyledrake 9y ago
      And the founder of Neocities thinks it's time to instate a distributed web https://blog.neocities.org/blog/2015/09/08/its-time-for-the-distributed-web.html https://blog.neocities.org/blog/2015/09/08/its-time-for-the-...
      - it_learnses 9y ago
        ok how will neocities or anybody hosting a node be compensated? How will the artists whose works are being distributed in this manner be compensated?
        thatcat 9y ago
        They probably won't, but could by using a distributed pay to host service like filecoin https://filecoin.io/ https://filecoin.io/
        kyledrake 9y ago
        How sites would make money? I'm not really thinking about that too much right now, but I suppose sites could do all the usual things they do with the current web (advertising, accepting payments via credit card gateways, Bitcoin, Patreon, etc). It doesn't have to be an all-or-nothing proposition and it certainly isn't to me. Some functionality will still require a centralized service, just not the entire thing.
        mcbits 9y ago
        With some sort of "proof of upstream" cryptocurrency that trickles a percentage back to the content's origin node along with other nodes in between. Users would earn credits by leaving their devices connected and forwarding data, paying most of it back into the network when downloading data. The original uploaders of very popular content would accumulate a surplus of credits, which they then sell to to mega-crawlers. Content creators would do well to be the original uploaders of their own content on such a network. The credits would also be incentive to buy devices and leave them running in poor-coverage areas. E.g. the owners of billboards could mount repeaters along rural highways.
davidcbc 9y ago
Why would my mother do that instead of just using Facebook which is already there and already had all of her friends and family on it?
- mirimir 9y ago
  Because maybe Facebook nukes her account, for whatever reason.
  - StephenConnell 9y ago
    I am an advocate of having your own domain and having control. But most people don't care as much as the hacker news crowd does. "Phone broke, here is my new number..." really? For business it's critical to maintain any form of communication you have ever offered. But for personal, a lot of people don't care if they change their [email] and inconvenience their friends and family. The internet is not crucial to everyones daily life. And honestly, it probably shouldn't be as crucial to ours.
  - nextlevelwizard 9y ago
    When has this actually happened? And by this I mean that out of nowhere Facebook suddenly has deleted someone's page and then not restored it? I get what you are suggesting, but I can't help but to think you are making this way bigger issue than it actually is. Also all of you are missing the most obvious point: if it hasn't happened to a lot (and I mean literally more than 10-20% of user base) it is not a significant risk and thus spending extra effort for literally no gain (and actually probably more of a loss in views/users/buyers/whatever) is not worth paying someone to design you a website and paying for updates and then A) paying for (yet another) 3rd party company to host your website B) learning how to setup, host, update, and maintain your own website. I'm sure most of people on this site could easily setup their own website and run it wherever, but the reason why people are paying you to do such things for living means that most people can't be bothered to learn all the necessary skills.
    - interfixus 9y ago
synicalx 9y ago
So, Wordpress basically?
JustSomeNobody 9y ago
Yes. But by website in a box, it would have to be as dirt simple as signing up for FB. So, gramma goes to a web page, clicks the signup, the website deploys a docker image on a webhost and spins up a UI that is not unlike what she is already used to. Next, comment and "likes". You have to have a comment system that runs on there also. Gramma would invite others to her site by clicking invite. This would generate a specific invite signature for that person and would email it out (gramma would need to know Uncle Fred's email; sorry gramma). Uncle Fred would click the link and be taken to gramma's sight and can comment. All comments stay on gramma's sight. All gramma's content, period, stay's on gramma's sight. How does one monetize, however?
- gagege 9y ago
  To monetize you could make referral deals with web hosts. I assume this setup means that gramma is paying the web host a fee.
- piaste 9y ago
  There are some docker images on DockerHub which are very polished along those lines. OwnCloud for storage, Ghost for blogging. You run them with default settings and they open to a nice welcome page with a tutorial and a fully-functional setup. With a docker UI like Kitematic, it's remarkably similar to an app store experience.

andrewwharton 9y ago

No one said anything about hosting your own email or making your own website. eg. My wife has a small business with an online store hosted on Shopify and her email provider is Gmail. But her website is www.her_domain.com and her email address is @her_domain.com. She can easily switch out her providers and her contact addresses don't change. No real tech knowledge needed except for how to register a domain name and follow some how-to docs from Shopify and Gmail.

nitemice 9y ago
I think this is the right attitude to take. It strikes the perfect balance between offloading your problems to the big guys, and keeping control if they decide to screw you over, or run off into the wild yonder. That doesn't mean they couldn't still mess you up pretty bad. You'd want a pretty solid backup scheme, and you'll still have to accept the loss of some levels of privacy etc. but that might be worth it to you to subsidise cheap services, while still having an escape plan.
- fivestar 9y ago
  They're already screwing us over--they took sides in the election and modified/molded content and search results in an attempt to push their agenda. That was evil.
davidcbc 9y ago
Registering a domain name may as well be magic to a large portion of the population.
- Spivak 9y ago
  The process of registering the domain behind the scenes might be a bit magic but buying one and pointing it at a hosting provider certainly isn't.
  - mcbits 9y ago
    You're ignoring (or overestimating) the enormous segment of the population who wouldn't even have an Internet presence if it didn't come with the phone, and getting the phone was already the one of the most mentally challenging things they've done in years.