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If men are 3x as likely to interrupt women, is it sexism or simply a biological tendency? And if it is a biological tendency, is it not sexist to shame men for

If men are 3x as likely to interrupt women, is it sexism or simply a biological tendency? And if it is a biological tendency, is it not sexist to shame men for their more assertive tendencies?

orbitingpluto 9y ago
If men are 3x as likely to engage in violent behaviour, is it sexism or simply a biological tendency? And if it is a biological tendency, is it not sexist to shame men for their more assertive tendencies? /sarcasm
- devmunchies 9y ago
  Interrupting somebody else isn't physically hurting anybody. This is a real argument that affects lots of people. Don't dilute it with your sarcastic strawmans.
  - orbitingpluto 9y ago
    I was countering one strawman argument with another. Please realize that the bar to meet here isn't violence, it's professional and courtesy.
    - devmunchies 9y ago
      When did I advocate violence? I was trying to take a step back by suggesting that there may be no sexism involved here. Its a valid point.
      - orbitingpluto 9y ago
        You didn't. I don't think you did. It was just a reverse moving goalposts argument to suggest that both propositions were wrong. But "if men are 3x as likely to interrupt women" is literally an example of sexism... the likelihood of interrupting a woman over interrupting a man. Sexism IS a biological tendency. There is no rational basis for it when scientists are contributing to something as esoteric as string theory. This story overwhelmingly demonstrates how absurd sexism can get. In any case it is perfectly acceptable to shame someone when they are being rude and excluding someone one from contributing. Especially when that someone is an expert. The reason why I think she did not take any affront is because she already understands the subject matter. She's motivated not only in understanding herself, but in determining and helping others to comprehend. She can't actually engage in a proper discussion until she realizes that her counterpart also understands the material. When things get complicated, you have to continually establish a common basis for discussion which requires fostering patience.
        walterstucco 9y ago
        > "if men are 3x as likely to interrupt women" is literally an example of sexism. no. because men don't interrupt women 3x as likely but it's sexism to assume they do just because you believe it's true
        walterstucco 9y ago
        > Sexism IS a biological tendency not at all sexism is behaviour sexism is believing that women cannot do something because women are inferior by design, not thinking that they are generally weaker (biologically true) and it's probably best if it's the man who carries the heavier luggage
ethbro 9y ago
Does it matter? I'd put the emphasis on the outcome: women being able to express their opinions and contribute to the conversation / problem. Being interrupted (while speaking less in the first place) seems counterproductive to that end.
- devmunchies 9y ago
  So its an argument between equal opportunity and equal outcome. It sounds like people want to shame men so as to gain an equal outcome. Is there a better solution? I'm being serious. (At the very least, we don't need to accuse men of being sexist if is proven to be a biological tendency—we should call a spade a spade)
  - ethbro 9y ago
    How is sexism that's biologically based not sexism? Just like biologically based racism (not my race) still being racist? The equal outcome is men and women both being given equal and fair opportunities to express their viewpoints. If this isn't the case because {reason}, then to me that's justification enough to attempt to redress the issue through modified behavior.

If men are 3x as likely to interrupt women, is it sexism or simply a biological tendency? And if it is a biological tendency, is it not sexist to shame men for their more assertive tendencies?

orbitingpluto 9y ago

If men are 3x as likely to engage in violent behaviour, is it sexism or simply a biological tendency? And if it is a biological tendency, is it not sexist to shame men for their more assertive tendencies? /sarcasm

devmunchies 9y ago
Interrupting somebody else isn't physically hurting anybody. This is a real argument that affects lots of people. Don't dilute it with your sarcastic strawmans.
- orbitingpluto 9y ago
  I was countering one strawman argument with another. Please realize that the bar to meet here isn't violence, it's professional and courtesy.
  - devmunchies 9y ago
    When did I advocate violence? I was trying to take a step back by suggesting that there may be no sexism involved here. Its a valid point.
    - orbitingpluto 9y ago
      You didn't. I don't think you did. It was just a reverse moving goalposts argument to suggest that both propositions were wrong. But "if men are 3x as likely to interrupt women" is literally an example of sexism... the likelihood of interrupting a woman over interrupting a man. Sexism IS a biological tendency. There is no rational basis for it when scientists are contributing to something as esoteric as string theory. This story overwhelmingly demonstrates how absurd sexism can get. In any case it is perfectly acceptable to shame someone when they are being rude and excluding someone one from contributing. Especially when that someone is an expert. The reason why I think she did not take any affront is because she already understands the subject matter. She's motivated not only in understanding herself, but in determining and helping others to comprehend. She can't actually engage in a proper discussion until she realizes that her counterpart also understands the material. When things get complicated, you have to continually establish a common basis for discussion which requires fostering patience.
      - walterstucco 9y ago
        > "if men are 3x as likely to interrupt women" is literally an example of sexism. no. because men don't interrupt women 3x as likely but it's sexism to assume they do just because you believe it's true
      - walterstucco 9y ago
        > Sexism IS a biological tendency not at all sexism is behaviour sexism is believing that women cannot do something because women are inferior by design, not thinking that they are generally weaker (biologically true) and it's probably best if it's the man who carries the heavier luggage

ethbro 9y ago

Does it matter? I'd put the emphasis on the outcome: women being able to express their opinions and contribute to the conversation / problem. Being interrupted (while speaking less in the first place) seems counterproductive to that end.

devmunchies 9y ago
So its an argument between equal opportunity and equal outcome. It sounds like people want to shame men so as to gain an equal outcome. Is there a better solution? I'm being serious. (At the very least, we don't need to accuse men of being sexist if is proven to be a biological tendency—we should call a spade a spade)
- ethbro 9y ago
  How is sexism that's biologically based not sexism? Just like biologically based racism (not my race) still being racist? The equal outcome is men and women both being given equal and fair opportunities to express their viewpoints. If this isn't the case because {reason}, then to me that's justification enough to attempt to redress the issue through modified behavior.