5 ms·

Open source Cocoa implementation for Windows and Linux

68 points by daeken 16y ago

spooneybarger 16y ago
Does this exist because someone wanted an open source version of the Cocoa apis that isn't GPL'd? Otherwise, I don't understand why they wouldn't just direct their energies into GNUStep.
- pavlov 16y ago
  The aims of the projects are quite different. Cocotron is designed purely as a porting toolchain, whereas GNUstep provides a complete IDE and many other cross-platform components. This difference in philosophy becomes evident in some practical ways: * Cocotron is designed for integration as a cross-compiler within Xcode. You can literally copy your Mac app or framework target and retarget it to Windows or Linux with a few clicks in Xcode. (GNUstep also does cross-compilers in theory, but integrating with Apple's IDE is not their prime focus because GNUstep traditionally has had its own Next-derived dev environment.) * Cocotron has a minimum of dependencies and tries to be very lightweight. Its Foundation and AppKit DLLs are just a few megabytes. * Cocotron aims for a platform-native look, at least as far as possible within the constraints of Mac OS X resource and code compatibility. * Cocotron's stated goal is Cocoa compatibility. It does not have its own public API extensions, unlike GNUstep.
js2 16y ago
FYI, http://cocoawithlove.com/2010/04/options-for-porting-objective-ccocoa.html http://cocoawithlove.com/2010/04/options-for-porting-objecti... http://cocoawithlove.com/2010/04/design-of-multi-platform-app-using.html http://cocoawithlove.com/2010/04/design-of-multi-platform-ap... http://cocoawithlove.com/2010/04/porting-mac-program-to-windows-using.html http://cocoawithlove.com/2010/04/porting-mac-program-to-wind... edited to put links in chronological order
- tedge 16y ago
  http://macdaddyworld.com/2008/10/27/adventures-in-cocotron/ http://macdaddyworld.com/2008/10/27/adventures-in-cocotron/
fredoliveira 16y ago
This is the first time I hear about Cocotron - and it seems to have quite a lot of activity based on the part of the changelog that I just looked at. I wish there was a bit more information on the Wiki pages (there is none at this point). More info would certainly facilitate developer adoption to what seems like (at the very least) a pretty interesting project. Kudos to the developers - looking forward to hearing more about it.
rbanffy 16y ago
I understand Cocotron can't borrow code from GNUStep, but can't GNUStep borrow code from Cocotron?
- chc 16y ago
  It could, but the two codebases are completely unrelated, so it might not always be useful.
  - cookiecaper 16y ago
    I assume by this you mean that they are independent implementations without a common ancestor, right? They seem to target the same thing, even though they don't share a common ancestor, so I would imagine that there is still a lot of potential for cross-pollenation.
  - rbanffy 16y ago
    I can't imagine Cocotron being so dependent on its internals as to make reusing parts of it on other projects impossible.
- dkastner 16y ago
  GNUStep is licensed under the GPL and has not implemented as many Cocoa features. Cocotron is licensed under MIT. Assuming that the GNUStep authors want to maintain a stricly GPL codebase, they would not want to borrow anything from cocotron. The authors of cocotron chose MIT specifically to be friendlier for commercial developers.
  - ekiru 16y ago
    MIT licensed code doesn't restrict the licenses of derivative works. Because of this it can be incorporated into a GPL codebase without affecting the licensing of the GPL codebase.
  - boucher 16y ago
    I don't think its fair to say that Cocotron has implemented more than GNUStep.
jws 16y ago
AppKit runs on Windows, Foundation on Windows, Linux and Solaris. Translation: No GUI on Linux or Solaris.
makmanalp 16y ago
Link to actual project page: http://www.cocotron.org/ http://www.cocotron.org/
Calamitous 16y ago
I'd really just rather have GTK work nicely on a mac, actually.
- Zev 16y ago
  GTK is a UI toolkit. Cocoa is more than just UI.
  - sqrt17 16y ago
    GTK/Glib/whatever is more than just UI just as Cocoa/Foundation/whatever is more than just UI. Oh, and GTK runs on far more platforms than Cocoa (Cocoa runs on Macs and iPhones/iPads, whereas you'd be able to use GTK on Mac, Windows, desktop and handheld Linux, as well as other Unix flavors)
    - deleted 16y ago
      [deleted]
dflock 16y ago
Hmmm... Textmate for Windows, finally? Heh.
- pornel 16y ago
  We're still waiting for Mac OS X release.
malkia 16y ago
As a way to develop on Windows with Cocotron is to use a dynamic language which binds to Cocotron. For example the Clozure Associates, have put in their open sourced common lisp - ccl the cocotron, and it's available from there.

68 points by daeken 16y ago

Does this exist because someone wanted an open source version of the Cocoa apis that isn't GPL'd? Otherwise, I don't understand why they wouldn't just direct their energies into GNUStep.

pavlov 16y ago
The aims of the projects are quite different. Cocotron is designed purely as a porting toolchain, whereas GNUstep provides a complete IDE and many other cross-platform components. This difference in philosophy becomes evident in some practical ways: * Cocotron is designed for integration as a cross-compiler within Xcode. You can literally copy your Mac app or framework target and retarget it to Windows or Linux with a few clicks in Xcode. (GNUstep also does cross-compilers in theory, but integrating with Apple's IDE is not their prime focus because GNUstep traditionally has had its own Next-derived dev environment.) * Cocotron has a minimum of dependencies and tries to be very lightweight. Its Foundation and AppKit DLLs are just a few megabytes. * Cocotron aims for a platform-native look, at least as far as possible within the constraints of Mac OS X resource and code compatibility. * Cocotron's stated goal is Cocoa compatibility. It does not have its own public API extensions, unlike GNUstep.

js2 16y ago

FYI, http://cocoawithlove.com/2010/04/options-for-porting-objective-ccocoa.html http://cocoawithlove.com/2010/04/options-for-porting-objecti... http://cocoawithlove.com/2010/04/design-of-multi-platform-app-using.html http://cocoawithlove.com/2010/04/design-of-multi-platform-ap... http://cocoawithlove.com/2010/04/porting-mac-program-to-windows-using.html http://cocoawithlove.com/2010/04/porting-mac-program-to-wind... edited to put links in chronological order

tedge 16y ago
http://macdaddyworld.com/2008/10/27/adventures-in-cocotron/ http://macdaddyworld.com/2008/10/27/adventures-in-cocotron/

fredoliveira 16y ago

This is the first time I hear about Cocotron - and it seems to have quite a lot of activity based on the part of the changelog that I just looked at. I wish there was a bit more information on the Wiki pages (there is none at this point). More info would certainly facilitate developer adoption to what seems like (at the very least) a pretty interesting project. Kudos to the developers - looking forward to hearing more about it.

rbanffy 16y ago

I understand Cocotron can't borrow code from GNUStep, but can't GNUStep borrow code from Cocotron?

chc 16y ago
It could, but the two codebases are completely unrelated, so it might not always be useful.
- cookiecaper 16y ago
  I assume by this you mean that they are independent implementations without a common ancestor, right? They seem to target the same thing, even though they don't share a common ancestor, so I would imagine that there is still a lot of potential for cross-pollenation.
- rbanffy 16y ago
  I can't imagine Cocotron being so dependent on its internals as to make reusing parts of it on other projects impossible.
dkastner 16y ago
GNUStep is licensed under the GPL and has not implemented as many Cocoa features. Cocotron is licensed under MIT. Assuming that the GNUStep authors want to maintain a stricly GPL codebase, they would not want to borrow anything from cocotron. The authors of cocotron chose MIT specifically to be friendlier for commercial developers.
- ekiru 16y ago
  MIT licensed code doesn't restrict the licenses of derivative works. Because of this it can be incorporated into a GPL codebase without affecting the licensing of the GPL codebase.
- boucher 16y ago
  I don't think its fair to say that Cocotron has implemented more than GNUStep.

jws 16y ago

AppKit runs on Windows, Foundation on Windows, Linux and Solaris. Translation: No GUI on Linux or Solaris.

makmanalp 16y ago

Link to actual project page: http://www.cocotron.org/ http://www.cocotron.org/

Calamitous 16y ago

I'd really just rather have GTK work nicely on a mac, actually.

Zev 16y ago
GTK is a UI toolkit. Cocoa is more than just UI.
- sqrt17 16y ago
  GTK/Glib/whatever is more than just UI just as Cocoa/Foundation/whatever is more than just UI. Oh, and GTK runs on far more platforms than Cocoa (Cocoa runs on Macs and iPhones/iPads, whereas you'd be able to use GTK on Mac, Windows, desktop and handheld Linux, as well as other Unix flavors)
  - deleted 16y ago
    [deleted]

dflock 16y ago

Hmmm... Textmate for Windows, finally? Heh.

pornel 16y ago
We're still waiting for Mac OS X release.

malkia 16y ago

As a way to develop on Windows with Cocotron is to use a dynamic language which binds to Cocotron. For example the Clozure Associates, have put in their open sourced common lisp - ccl the cocotron, and it's available from there.