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Well, Switzerland is rich because they have our tax-money. They also do have a lot of high-tech, precision engineering industry, don't they? Japan is an intere

Well, Switzerland is rich because they have our tax-money. They also do have a lot of high-tech, precision engineering industry, don't they? Japan is an interesting example - they have negative interest rates since a very long time. Basically, I was talking about Germany. The German automotive industry plus the machinery section create a lot of well paying industry jobs (although the well-paying part is really hollowed out and wages rising way to slow in Germany). The political landscape is stable (although I despise the conservative government). Germans version of Trump/Brexit/Le Pen has about 8% in the surveys for the election. Gini-Index is way more healthy than in other nations (although getting worse). But you are completely right, there is a lot of things missing in the picture (or wrong).

tobltobs 9y ago
> Well, Switzerland is rich because they have our tax-money. Isn't that now in Delaware?
- turbinerneiter 9y ago
  It sure isn't in the pothole in the road to my building, I can tell you that.
  - Bjartr 9y ago
    Depending on municipality you may be able to report the pothole directly. Assuming you already haven't been proactive in that manner it may be a way to nudge things into action.
prodmerc 9y ago
Since you were talking about Germany and jobs being a means of distributing wealth of sorts, what do you think about the taxes? Germany, Austria, Netherlands, Belgium all have some very high taxes on high earners compared to the US and UK, and more importantly, the progressive tax thresholds are much better adjusted for poor and middle class people to have more disposable income. Germany even has a solidarity tax on top of the normal income tax, which also goes into the country's budget. Correct me if I'm wrong. And for some reason, these countries' rich people actually do pay their taxes for the most part, instead of hiding them using various means. That's either because of the education or the culture, I don't know.
- ransom1538 9y ago
  In Belgium your tax rate is %50 (over 38,080eur[2]). That is totally insane I thought... The US: For hn types, the tax rate would be 28% (fed) + 10% (state tax CA) + 9% (medical cost deductions per paycheck[1]) + 8% sales tax (ca) = 55%? (also subtract medical bills will seize all your property later in life though, and any private schools needed). I am sure Belgium has many other costs, hell add %10 to Belgium. It is still comparable. [1] http://budgeting.thenest.com/much-average-paycheck-gets-deducted-health-insurance-31197.html http://budgeting.thenest.com/much-average-paycheck-gets-dedu... [2] http://taxsummaries.pwc.com/ID/Belgium-Individual-Taxes-on-personal-income http://taxsummaries.pwc.com/ID/Belgium-Individual-Taxes-on-p...
  - turbinerneiter 9y ago
    Add university. I graduated with 20k savings, Americans with 200k debt.
- turbinerneiter 9y ago
  Taxes aren't that high in Germany. 40% - compared to what, 35% in the US? Especially considering that a lot of what you pay in Germany is not a tax but insurance - health, social security, rent. Also, no the taxes for high earners aren't that huge. Basically, the progressive tax stops growing at 50k and stays at 42% income tax. The insurances aren't progressive. If you take the total tax payed it's pretty flat over the whole income spectrum. I.e. sales tax hit rich people less because they don't have to consume all their income. Tax on property and wealth are low to non-existent. No inheritance tax either. Middle class is actually where the tax increase is the steepest. Poor people as in working poor are relatively new in Germany - low income sector was created about two decades ago. And no, our richt don't pay their taxes either. Top 0.1% evades 30% of taxes, among the 99.9% rest it's pretty much uniform 5%. There was an awesome report that I can't find right now. Workers in Germany also often can't evade. My tax is deduced before I'm, payed. Some jobs can evade tax by moonlighting. Generally, _people_, even rich, pay their taxes (as they have no choice) - it's companies that evade big time. And the filthy rich. Situation is much better than in the US, but the whole tax system is still bad. Basically, tax on profit is the best you can have. Companies either pay or invest - both cases are a win. Tax evasion breaks that and workers have to pay.
walrus1066 9y ago
One could argue that Germany has an undervalued currency, which makes its exports more competitive, both in and out of the EU. The flipside is that countries like Spain have overvalued currencies, which means the jobs flow from there to Germany. Hence the chronic unemployment in Spain. Sure, they have solid fundamental economic strengths, but a huge part of their recent success comes at the expense of other eurozone countries, due to the flawed euro currency union.
- turbinerneiter 9y ago
  Very true. Funny thing is, Germany is forbidding Greece to do what they did when they had to jumpstart their economy after reunification: lower taxes. German politics is very problematic for the eurozone at the moment. Schäuble doesn't understand basic economy.

tobltobs 9y ago

> Well, Switzerland is rich because they have our tax-money. Isn't that now in Delaware?

turbinerneiter 9y ago
It sure isn't in the pothole in the road to my building, I can tell you that.
- Bjartr 9y ago
  Depending on municipality you may be able to report the pothole directly. Assuming you already haven't been proactive in that manner it may be a way to nudge things into action.

prodmerc 9y ago

Since you were talking about Germany and jobs being a means of distributing wealth of sorts, what do you think about the taxes? Germany, Austria, Netherlands, Belgium all have some very high taxes on high earners compared to the US and UK, and more importantly, the progressive tax thresholds are much better adjusted for poor and middle class people to have more disposable income. Germany even has a solidarity tax on top of the normal income tax, which also goes into the country's budget. Correct me if I'm wrong. And for some reason, these countries' rich people actually do pay their taxes for the most part, instead of hiding them using various means. That's either because of the education or the culture, I don't know.

ransom1538 9y ago
In Belgium your tax rate is %50 (over 38,080eur[2]). That is totally insane I thought... The US: For hn types, the tax rate would be 28% (fed) + 10% (state tax CA) + 9% (medical cost deductions per paycheck[1]) + 8% sales tax (ca) = 55%? (also subtract medical bills will seize all your property later in life though, and any private schools needed). I am sure Belgium has many other costs, hell add %10 to Belgium. It is still comparable. [1] http://budgeting.thenest.com/much-average-paycheck-gets-deducted-health-insurance-31197.html http://budgeting.thenest.com/much-average-paycheck-gets-dedu... [2] http://taxsummaries.pwc.com/ID/Belgium-Individual-Taxes-on-personal-income http://taxsummaries.pwc.com/ID/Belgium-Individual-Taxes-on-p...
- turbinerneiter 9y ago
  Add university. I graduated with 20k savings, Americans with 200k debt.
turbinerneiter 9y ago
Taxes aren't that high in Germany. 40% - compared to what, 35% in the US? Especially considering that a lot of what you pay in Germany is not a tax but insurance - health, social security, rent. Also, no the taxes for high earners aren't that huge. Basically, the progressive tax stops growing at 50k and stays at 42% income tax. The insurances aren't progressive. If you take the total tax payed it's pretty flat over the whole income spectrum. I.e. sales tax hit rich people less because they don't have to consume all their income. Tax on property and wealth are low to non-existent. No inheritance tax either. Middle class is actually where the tax increase is the steepest. Poor people as in working poor are relatively new in Germany - low income sector was created about two decades ago. And no, our richt don't pay their taxes either. Top 0.1% evades 30% of taxes, among the 99.9% rest it's pretty much uniform 5%. There was an awesome report that I can't find right now. Workers in Germany also often can't evade. My tax is deduced before I'm, payed. Some jobs can evade tax by moonlighting. Generally, _people_, even rich, pay their taxes (as they have no choice) - it's companies that evade big time. And the filthy rich. Situation is much better than in the US, but the whole tax system is still bad. Basically, tax on profit is the best you can have. Companies either pay or invest - both cases are a win. Tax evasion breaks that and workers have to pay.

walrus1066 9y ago

One could argue that Germany has an undervalued currency, which makes its exports more competitive, both in and out of the EU. The flipside is that countries like Spain have overvalued currencies, which means the jobs flow from there to Germany. Hence the chronic unemployment in Spain. Sure, they have solid fundamental economic strengths, but a huge part of their recent success comes at the expense of other eurozone countries, due to the flawed euro currency union.

turbinerneiter 9y ago
Very true. Funny thing is, Germany is forbidding Greece to do what they did when they had to jumpstart their economy after reunification: lower taxes. German politics is very problematic for the eurozone at the moment. Schäuble doesn't understand basic economy.