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The main thing we can learn from history, is that we do not in fact learn from history. That's what I have taken from B.H. Liddell Hart's great little book "Why

The main thing we can learn from history, is that we do not in fact learn from history. That's what I have taken from B.H. Liddell Hart's great little book "Why Don't We Learn From History?" and it is exactly what is happening here in education, again. Today on the HN homepage there was an article about how NJ was the innovation hub of American before the Valley, which generated a nice discussion. Akarnani recounted the story of Fred Terman's failed effort to make NJ more like the Valley. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14497136 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14497136 This historical anecdotes illustrates how even when many essential pieces are present (money, smart people, etc) it is a nearly Sisyphean task to change a system and a culture. The great management thinker W. Edwards Deming once said "a bad system will beat a good person every time" and that is the history of the past 60 years in education reform. I wrote about that in more detail here. https://medium.com/@m_pettyjohn/on-humans-hard-problems-and-complex-systems-8c2aa2d176a2 https://medium.com/@m_pettyjohn/on-humans-hard-problems-and-... This NYTimes article reaches out and touches nearly every broken aspect of education that makes improvement seem intractable. Zuckerberg wasted $100 million in Newark and seemingly came away learning the wrong lessons. Benioff, big hearted and charitable, has his heart in the right place, but long-term will have little impact. With that in mind it is almost inconsequential what the Silicon Valley billionaires do in education. There is massive potential in our teachers and students, but to unleash it we need to understand our history, take a systems view and approach, and genuinely understand the discipline of management, which even to the big successes in the Valley seems like an afterthought. If you're outside (or even inside!) education, reading The Case of Mrs. Oublier, a study of one California teacher during the state's massive 80's reform effort, can be enlightening to the challenges faced. https://393methods1.wikispaces.com/file/view/Cohen,+D.+K.+(1990).pdf https://393methods1.wikispaces.com/file/view/Cohen,+D.+K.+(1...

devindotcom 9y ago
Well said. And it's important to carefully investigate the limits of the system that is to be improved, as it almost certainly is larger and more complex than anyone thinks. More money is good, better tech is good, better pay for teachers is good, but these are hot spots on a huge network of systems and circumstances. "Holistic approach" is an overworked phrase but it's the thing we need here because education overlaps in so many ways with other aspects of society.
- Consultant32452 9y ago
  Interestingly, the best available research suggests that adding better tech to schools doesn't seem to improve education outcomes. http://www.bbc.com/news/business-34174796 http://www.bbc.com/news/business-34174796
  - heymijo 9y ago
    That's not surprising. Let's take a look at this from the teacher side of things: Next let's substitute computers for manipulatives (something you can model math with such as a place value block) for the educational treatment. In the PDF I linked above about Mrs. Oublier, she reports she is using all of the prescribed educational treatments in her classroom. From manipulatives to small groups. She's even excited about them. Calls it a revolution! Then the researchers visit her classroom and while all of the pieces are there, none of the understanding how to use the treatments is present. This happens systemically, and it's what I have seen happen with technology in schools. In education we talk about how you teach, pedagogy, and what you teach, content as 'pedagogical content knowledge.' Whether it's blocks, small groups, smart-boards, or software it won't change the pedagogical content knowledge the teacher is bringing to the table. And in the great irony of our education system, our schools are not set up to learn (at least not effectively) so it's very hard to meaningfully move the pedagogical content quotient, especially throughout the system.
  - heymijo 9y ago
    We can also look at tech from the student side of things: There is some nice software out there. Desmos comes to mind. https://teacher.desmos.com https://teacher.desmos.com But most software that makes its way into schools is not Desmos. It's usually something that merely replicates the content delivery method of teaching. Think Khan Academy. Other software is often just a digital way to practice facts or algorithms (my mind is in the math world for these examples). I noticed an older comment of yours about expectations your first CS class had including how to navigate a nix system, at least one programming language, and Matlab. Let's pretend this class was instead algebra I where a student is expected to know the fundamentals of arithmetic including properties of operations (so you can use them to manipulate equations), that the equals sign indicates balance, exponentiation, strong proportional reasoning with a solid understanding of multiplication/division, and an understanding of integers. Combine this with a course where the teacher delivers a lesson each day, you do homework, and then have a test each week, never stopping to go back to things that may not have sunk in, let alone pausing to work on any holes in the things mentioned above that are critical to understanding algebra. I can introduce Desmos to help you model linear equations in a wonderful interface, but it isn't going to do a damn thing to increase outcomes if a) you are lacking in any of the requisite starting knowledge and b) don't go to extraordinary lengths to keep up with the pace of the course. I like tech, but I don't think it's any sort of panacea for what ails our schools because it doesn't (and maybe can't) address the root causes.
mahyarm 9y ago
How possible would it be for a group of parents to hire a teacher and have them teach 6-12 kids at someone's house? Sidestepping a lot of the administration BS?
- heymijo 9y ago
  Depends on your state. I'm in Ohio and that's perfectly permissible. Under the Ohio Revised Code and the State Operating Standards for Schools you could do that and have it be considered a) home schooling or b) a private school where you would be exempted from a large portion of the operating standards. In other words, you have significantly more flexibility in how and what you teach.
tomcam 9y ago
Read the report. Horrifying. The teacher who is the subject of the paper was convinced to use "new" techniques of teaching math. These techniques are mandated by the education code but are not explained. She ended up with a melange of old and new techniques but applied them all blindly. I finished the paper thoroughly convinced that the old fashion and technique of rote memorization and drills would be superior in almost all cases.
- heymijo 9y ago
  The saddest part of doing this to teachers is that it's students who always lose the most.

devindotcom 9y ago

Well said. And it's important to carefully investigate the limits of the system that is to be improved, as it almost certainly is larger and more complex than anyone thinks. More money is good, better tech is good, better pay for teachers is good, but these are hot spots on a huge network of systems and circumstances. "Holistic approach" is an overworked phrase but it's the thing we need here because education overlaps in so many ways with other aspects of society.

Consultant32452 9y ago
Interestingly, the best available research suggests that adding better tech to schools doesn't seem to improve education outcomes. http://www.bbc.com/news/business-34174796 http://www.bbc.com/news/business-34174796
- heymijo 9y ago
  That's not surprising. Let's take a look at this from the teacher side of things: Next let's substitute computers for manipulatives (something you can model math with such as a place value block) for the educational treatment. In the PDF I linked above about Mrs. Oublier, she reports she is using all of the prescribed educational treatments in her classroom. From manipulatives to small groups. She's even excited about them. Calls it a revolution! Then the researchers visit her classroom and while all of the pieces are there, none of the understanding how to use the treatments is present. This happens systemically, and it's what I have seen happen with technology in schools. In education we talk about how you teach, pedagogy, and what you teach, content as 'pedagogical content knowledge.' Whether it's blocks, small groups, smart-boards, or software it won't change the pedagogical content knowledge the teacher is bringing to the table. And in the great irony of our education system, our schools are not set up to learn (at least not effectively) so it's very hard to meaningfully move the pedagogical content quotient, especially throughout the system.
- heymijo 9y ago
  We can also look at tech from the student side of things: There is some nice software out there. Desmos comes to mind. https://teacher.desmos.com https://teacher.desmos.com But most software that makes its way into schools is not Desmos. It's usually something that merely replicates the content delivery method of teaching. Think Khan Academy. Other software is often just a digital way to practice facts or algorithms (my mind is in the math world for these examples). I noticed an older comment of yours about expectations your first CS class had including how to navigate a nix system, at least one programming language, and Matlab. Let's pretend this class was instead algebra I where a student is expected to know the fundamentals of arithmetic including properties of operations (so you can use them to manipulate equations), that the equals sign indicates balance, exponentiation, strong proportional reasoning with a solid understanding of multiplication/division, and an understanding of integers. Combine this with a course where the teacher delivers a lesson each day, you do homework, and then have a test each week, never stopping to go back to things that may not have sunk in, let alone pausing to work on any holes in the things mentioned above that are critical to understanding algebra. I can introduce Desmos to help you model linear equations in a wonderful interface, but it isn't going to do a damn thing to increase outcomes if a) you are lacking in any of the requisite starting knowledge and b) don't go to extraordinary lengths to keep up with the pace of the course. I like tech, but I don't think it's any sort of panacea for what ails our schools because it doesn't (and maybe can't) address the root causes.

mahyarm 9y ago

How possible would it be for a group of parents to hire a teacher and have them teach 6-12 kids at someone's house? Sidestepping a lot of the administration BS?

heymijo 9y ago
Depends on your state. I'm in Ohio and that's perfectly permissible. Under the Ohio Revised Code and the State Operating Standards for Schools you could do that and have it be considered a) home schooling or b) a private school where you would be exempted from a large portion of the operating standards. In other words, you have significantly more flexibility in how and what you teach.

tomcam 9y ago

Read the report. Horrifying. The teacher who is the subject of the paper was convinced to use "new" techniques of teaching math. These techniques are mandated by the education code but are not explained. She ended up with a melange of old and new techniques but applied them all blindly. I finished the paper thoroughly convinced that the old fashion and technique of rote memorization and drills would be superior in almost all cases.

heymijo 9y ago
The saddest part of doing this to teachers is that it's students who always lose the most.