5 ms·

While the guy's story is very heart-warming, the most important part, which they quickly glossed over, was his getting married to an American lady who helped hi

While the guy's story is very heart-warming, the most important part, which they quickly glossed over, was his getting married to an American lady who helped him migrate. Without that marriage, he would most probably still be in Ghana. Also: he was performing an important role in Ghana delivering medicines, and by migrating, now that sector has lost an important person. I wish he would go back with his newfound knowledge and help make things better in Ghana, where he is needed much more than in the US.

partycoder 9y ago
Not sure about that. Ghana and other countries might have sovereignty in paper, but in practice they're victims of a new form of colonization: debt. A hardworking person like him could go waste his entire life trying to improve his country economy, but as soon as things get a bit better, a corrupt leader will go and contract debt from vulture funds like the IMF again, pass hundreds of millions of dollars to his personal account in Switzerland and ruin his country again for many decades in 5 minutes. If you want poverty to end, end vulture funds and end banking protections for corrupt leaders. But of course that will never happen, because those dictators are the very reason countries can contract high interest loans and neocolonial powers depend on that to succeed. Neocolonial powers also depend on disorganization. They cannot allow a strong government defending national interests to be formed. That would mean equal treaties, fair taxation, putting people to work for their own well being, expensive labor and expensive raw materials. This is why they will do all they can to get the corrupt guy elected by all means necessary, even if it involves killing. Your view of the world is very narrow.
- phr4ts 9y ago
  Authority stealing depends hugely on opaqueness, the ability of elected individuals to have privacy in their supposedly PUBLIC dealings. Thieves in position of authority benefit from EXPERT status i.e. citizens do not feel qualified to monitor the activities the activities of the elected. Officials openly flout their ill gotten wealth and the citizens are in awe, praying to God for a chance to eat the 'National cake.' Just last month, I talked to at least 10 ordinary persons. And these 'educated' individuals couldn't suspend disbelieve and imagine how much better their world would be if they could keep their representatives in check. They all believed that their votes didn't matter. And it's quite true. In the last Nigerian election for instance, individuals from the Igbo tribe weren't given voters card because they wouldn't vote for the incumbent party. I've spent a ton of time thinking about the state of Africa. And I don't see a way out short of a bloody revolution. Even then, history says a revolution would only replace one set of tyrants with another.
  - sangnoir 9y ago
    > ...about the state of Africa. It would help to think on a country-by-country basis. Generalizing over the entire continent of 54 countries is not useful, I have noticed people go with their feelings rather than facts when the topic is Africa - even on HN. By way of example, I have been impressed by South Africa's checks and balances over the last few years. A dedicated public protector, independent judiciary, a free press and a robust opposition. > I've spent a ton of time thinking about the state of Africa. And I don't see a way out short of a bloody revolution I have done the same, and the conclusion I came to is that African countries need a strong middle class. Poverty encourages patronage-politics and keeps the populace worrying about bread-and-butter issues rather than the more abstract issues of policies. If you (the reader, not parent) have the time to evaluate your biases, I would appreciate it if you would take a minute to make a Self Assessment: answer the following question in your head and do a google search to find the real answer. 1. How many active conflicts are in Africa? How many countries are affected (out of 54) 2. How many countries are afflicted by famine?
    - areyousure 9y ago
      While I believe in generalization as a useful tool, your final questions were useful exercises. For the sake of others, my research suggests the following: 1. Countries involved in active conflicts with over 100 deaths/year include Somalia, Kenya, Nigeria (x2), Cameroon, Niger (x2), Chad, Sudan (x3), Libya, Egypt (x2), South Sudan, Ethiopia (x3), Democratic Republic of the Congo (x2), Burundi (x4), Algeria, Burkina Faso, Tunisia, Central African Republic, Mali, and Mozambique. This is 21 or so separate conflicts in 19 of the 54 countries. (There are at least 8 smaller conflicts involving 4 more countries.) 2. In the last 20 years, there have been notable famines threatening Sudan, Ethiopia (x2), Democratic Republic of the Congo, Niger (x2), Chad, Somalia, Djibouti, Kenya, Uganda, Senegal, Gambia, Mauritania, Mali, and Burkina Faso. At present, there appears to only be one famine, affecting half of South Sudan. All in all, it appears that the expected number of active conflicts per country per year is 40--50%, and the expected number of countries involved in famines (again per country per year) is 1--1.5%.
      - 9y ago
arjie 9y ago
The part about marriage is very true. I take issue with your other part, though. I don't think his domain knowledge delivering medicine in Ghana is of very high value. It is probably easily attained. That means that all the value of his going back to Ghana is provided on the basis of his education. This means that anyone with his education is a good candidate for the job. So why ask immigrants specifically to compensate for brain drain? Why shouldn't any of the people graduating from Johns Hopkins go to Ghana and solve their healthcare? Any of them would be needed much more there than in the US. Tying people to the country of their birth is nonsense. If it's utilitarianism we seek, let's send our infectious diseases experts over there. That's where they're needed. Not at the CDC.
- yorwba 9y ago
  > So why ask immigrants specifically to compensate for brain drain? They are already fluent in the local language(s), so they can be more effective right from the start. Of course that doesn't mean that others can't support them, even if they have no personal connection to the country.
- arcticfox 9y ago
  > If it's utilitarianism we seek, let's send our infectious diseases experts over there. That's where they're needed. Not at the CDC. Not really, it's a much better idea to have most of the experts at the CDC and simply send samples from Ghana. Then when the experts decide what to do, pay non-experts to implement it.
- skybrian 9y ago
  This argument treats local knowledge as worthless. Wouldn't most US graduates be more or less helpless there, without knowing the language or customs? At least in the short term, you'd need a guide and translator, which makes you a tourist (someone being taken care of for the money it brings) rather someone contributing through your work. A recent emigrant seems likely to have a more valuable combination of skills.
- 1024core 9y ago
  > I don't think his domain knowledge delivering medicine in Ghana is of very high value. It is probably easily attained. That means that all the value of his going back to Ghana is provided on the basis of his education. This means that anyone with his education is a good candidate for the job. I disagree. It's much easier to give a person a 4-year education in something like Public Health Policy, than to give someone a 25-year education in language, culture, politics, etc. etc. And in the end, regardless of how hard you try, if you're a foreigner trying to do that job, you will never be trusted as "one of us" by the locals.

partycoder 9y ago

Not sure about that. Ghana and other countries might have sovereignty in paper, but in practice they're victims of a new form of colonization: debt. A hardworking person like him could go waste his entire life trying to improve his country economy, but as soon as things get a bit better, a corrupt leader will go and contract debt from vulture funds like the IMF again, pass hundreds of millions of dollars to his personal account in Switzerland and ruin his country again for many decades in 5 minutes. If you want poverty to end, end vulture funds and end banking protections for corrupt leaders. But of course that will never happen, because those dictators are the very reason countries can contract high interest loans and neocolonial powers depend on that to succeed. Neocolonial powers also depend on disorganization. They cannot allow a strong government defending national interests to be formed. That would mean equal treaties, fair taxation, putting people to work for their own well being, expensive labor and expensive raw materials. This is why they will do all they can to get the corrupt guy elected by all means necessary, even if it involves killing. Your view of the world is very narrow.

phr4ts 9y ago
Authority stealing depends hugely on opaqueness, the ability of elected individuals to have privacy in their supposedly PUBLIC dealings. Thieves in position of authority benefit from EXPERT status i.e. citizens do not feel qualified to monitor the activities the activities of the elected. Officials openly flout their ill gotten wealth and the citizens are in awe, praying to God for a chance to eat the 'National cake.' Just last month, I talked to at least 10 ordinary persons. And these 'educated' individuals couldn't suspend disbelieve and imagine how much better their world would be if they could keep their representatives in check. They all believed that their votes didn't matter. And it's quite true. In the last Nigerian election for instance, individuals from the Igbo tribe weren't given voters card because they wouldn't vote for the incumbent party. I've spent a ton of time thinking about the state of Africa. And I don't see a way out short of a bloody revolution. Even then, history says a revolution would only replace one set of tyrants with another.
- sangnoir 9y ago
  > ...about the state of Africa. It would help to think on a country-by-country basis. Generalizing over the entire continent of 54 countries is not useful, I have noticed people go with their feelings rather than facts when the topic is Africa - even on HN. By way of example, I have been impressed by South Africa's checks and balances over the last few years. A dedicated public protector, independent judiciary, a free press and a robust opposition. > I've spent a ton of time thinking about the state of Africa. And I don't see a way out short of a bloody revolution I have done the same, and the conclusion I came to is that African countries need a strong middle class. Poverty encourages patronage-politics and keeps the populace worrying about bread-and-butter issues rather than the more abstract issues of policies. If you (the reader, not parent) have the time to evaluate your biases, I would appreciate it if you would take a minute to make a Self Assessment: answer the following question in your head and do a google search to find the real answer. 1. How many active conflicts are in Africa? How many countries are affected (out of 54) 2. How many countries are afflicted by famine?
  - areyousure 9y ago
    While I believe in generalization as a useful tool, your final questions were useful exercises. For the sake of others, my research suggests the following: 1. Countries involved in active conflicts with over 100 deaths/year include Somalia, Kenya, Nigeria (x2), Cameroon, Niger (x2), Chad, Sudan (x3), Libya, Egypt (x2), South Sudan, Ethiopia (x3), Democratic Republic of the Congo (x2), Burundi (x4), Algeria, Burkina Faso, Tunisia, Central African Republic, Mali, and Mozambique. This is 21 or so separate conflicts in 19 of the 54 countries. (There are at least 8 smaller conflicts involving 4 more countries.) 2. In the last 20 years, there have been notable famines threatening Sudan, Ethiopia (x2), Democratic Republic of the Congo, Niger (x2), Chad, Somalia, Djibouti, Kenya, Uganda, Senegal, Gambia, Mauritania, Mali, and Burkina Faso. At present, there appears to only be one famine, affecting half of South Sudan. All in all, it appears that the expected number of active conflicts per country per year is 40--50%, and the expected number of countries involved in famines (again per country per year) is 1--1.5%.
    - 9y ago

arjie 9y ago

The part about marriage is very true. I take issue with your other part, though. I don't think his domain knowledge delivering medicine in Ghana is of very high value. It is probably easily attained. That means that all the value of his going back to Ghana is provided on the basis of his education. This means that anyone with his education is a good candidate for the job. So why ask immigrants specifically to compensate for brain drain? Why shouldn't any of the people graduating from Johns Hopkins go to Ghana and solve their healthcare? Any of them would be needed much more there than in the US. Tying people to the country of their birth is nonsense. If it's utilitarianism we seek, let's send our infectious diseases experts over there. That's where they're needed. Not at the CDC.

yorwba 9y ago
> So why ask immigrants specifically to compensate for brain drain? They are already fluent in the local language(s), so they can be more effective right from the start. Of course that doesn't mean that others can't support them, even if they have no personal connection to the country.
arcticfox 9y ago
> If it's utilitarianism we seek, let's send our infectious diseases experts over there. That's where they're needed. Not at the CDC. Not really, it's a much better idea to have most of the experts at the CDC and simply send samples from Ghana. Then when the experts decide what to do, pay non-experts to implement it.
skybrian 9y ago
This argument treats local knowledge as worthless. Wouldn't most US graduates be more or less helpless there, without knowing the language or customs? At least in the short term, you'd need a guide and translator, which makes you a tourist (someone being taken care of for the money it brings) rather someone contributing through your work. A recent emigrant seems likely to have a more valuable combination of skills.
1024core 9y ago
> I don't think his domain knowledge delivering medicine in Ghana is of very high value. It is probably easily attained. That means that all the value of his going back to Ghana is provided on the basis of his education. This means that anyone with his education is a good candidate for the job. I disagree. It's much easier to give a person a 4-year education in something like Public Health Policy, than to give someone a 25-year education in language, culture, politics, etc. etc. And in the end, regardless of how hard you try, if you're a foreigner trying to do that job, you will never be trusted as "one of us" by the locals.