7 ms·

Is it only shady because you believe Walmart employees are not paid enough as is? Doctors can choose to moonlight and get paid extra, and I don't think anyone

by v45h 9y ago

Is it only shady because you believe Walmart employees are not paid enough as is? Doctors can choose to moonlight and get paid extra, and I don't think anyone is complaining about that. And overtime is certainly a thing. Coming from Walmart's perspective, I'm assuming it just seemed like a smart business decision rather than something maliciously intended. Like hey look, we can make our customers and employees happier in a profitable manner thereby keeping up with our competitor (Amazon). If the employees have complaints about this then I guess perhaps it can be called into question. But at the end of the day won't most employees be happy about this?

ghostly_s 9y ago
> Doctors can choose to moonlight and get paid extra, and I don't think anyone is complaining about that. Doctors have that choice, and yet they don't do that. I wonder why?
- briandear 9y ago
  That just isn't true at all. In fact, it's patently false. https://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/12/24/the-doctor-as-moonlighter/?_r=0 https://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/12/24/the-doctor-as-moon...
- potatoyogurt 9y ago
  >In Medical Economics’ 2013 annual survey, 36% of family medicine/general practitioners and 35% of internists reported earning income from sources other than their primary practice/employer in 2012. That number was about the same for cardiologists (38%), but was higher for hospitalists (40%). Pediatricians and gastroenterologists were lower, at 25% and 27%, respectively. http://medicaleconomics.modernmedicine.com/medical-economics/content/tags/career-advice/moonlighting-physicians-expand-income-experience-taking?page=full http://medicaleconomics.modernmedicine.com/medical-economics...
  - xienze 9y ago
    To add to that, a lot of doctors at urgent care clinics (after hours, at least) are moonlighting.
  - alistairSH 9y ago
    Unless I missed it, that report doesn't indicate the total hours worked, only rates at which doctors perform work outside their primary clinical job. There is also a massive difference between a doctor taking a side job because they enjoy it and a WalMart associate taking a delivery job because they have no choice.
    - phamilton 9y ago
      > 35% of internists reported earning income from sources other than their primary practice > There is also a massive difference between a doctor taking a side job because they enjoy it and a WalMart associate taking a delivery job because they have no choice. I suggest you become more familiar with what medical interns get paid and their lifestyle. They are certainly moonlighting to pay the bills.
      - mtberatwork 9y ago
        Internist as in "internal medicine", not as in "unpaid intern".
        alistairSH 9y ago
        In the US, we have medical interns. They have completed their classroom studies, but not yet started residencies. They typically work as poorly paid interns for 18 months(?), doing quick rotations through the various specialties, before moving on to their residencies. They are paid poorly. I think the base rate is about $35k/year. But, at this point, they are still effectively students. I believe the MD is granted upon completion of the internship (or maybe they have the MD, but not the license to practice, I can never remember).
        ghostly_s 9y ago
        Ugh. Internist is not a synonym for intern, unpaid or otherwise. An 'internist' is a sub-specialty of fully-licensed medical doctor, as in 'internal medicine'. It's equivalent to a pediatrician except specifically focused on care for adult patients, in contrast to a 'family practice' or 'general practice' doctor, who focuses on both adult and pediatric patients.
  - ghostly_s 9y ago
    I'm pretty skeptical of the level to which they've dived into these results. 43% of the respondents said they receive supplemental income from "other medical" work. There exists a massive network of funding backed by pharmaceutical companies which essentially launders money into the pockets of physicians through things like highly-paid consultancy roles, speaking engagements, etc. Ostensibly these types of things would be covered by the 'speaking engagement' and 'consulting' categories, but the low figures there do not jive with my anecdotal knowledge of the field so I'm not really willing to accept these self-reported results as accurate considering that massive "other" result. Just looking at the figures as presented, it seems the average rate of moonlighting is in the range of 34%, and of the types of moonlighting reported, I'd only characterize about 37% as direct medical practice. So that adds up to 13% of practitioners who are actually practicing medicine somewhere else in their free time. Not unheard of, but far from the norm, so I stand by my point. The great majority of doctors are not picking up shifts somewhere else, because the great majority of them don't need the extra income.
- smileysteve 9y ago
  Beyond Doctors, a lot of software engineers are highly paid and moonlight as well. Or startup founders driving for uber.
  - frik 9y ago
    > Or startup founders driving for uber. So it really happens? I though it was joke in "Silicon Valley" TV series S04E01.
- EpicEng 9y ago
  Well I guess just making things up is one approach to debate, eh?
Chaebixi 9y ago
> Coming from Walmart's perspective, I'm assuming it just seemed like a smart business decision rather than something maliciously intended. I think that's exactly what the parent comment was criticizing: >> Ugh. I think that this sort of attitude (which was my initial reaction too) is a big part of what's wrong with our current economy. To restate: what's wrong with our economy is that we evaluate things, first and foremost, on if they're a "smart business decision" or not. That leads to "smart business decisions" are shady when looked at from many other perspectives.
hdhdjjdjd7773 9y ago
Let's not compare economic apples and oranges Doctors don't make minimum wage Why should most employees who could be better off if Walmart just paid more spend MORE time working to support Walmarts interests Because they don't have any other real options. That's the real manipulation Doctors on the other hand can drop out of medicine and have life experiences and/or education to take them in a number of directions

by v45h 9y ago

ghostly_s 9y ago

> Doctors can choose to moonlight and get paid extra, and I don't think anyone is complaining about that. Doctors have that choice, and yet they don't do that. I wonder why?

briandear 9y ago
That just isn't true at all. In fact, it's patently false. https://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/12/24/the-doctor-as-moonlighter/?_r=0 https://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/12/24/the-doctor-as-moon...
potatoyogurt 9y ago
>In Medical Economics’ 2013 annual survey, 36% of family medicine/general practitioners and 35% of internists reported earning income from sources other than their primary practice/employer in 2012. That number was about the same for cardiologists (38%), but was higher for hospitalists (40%). Pediatricians and gastroenterologists were lower, at 25% and 27%, respectively. http://medicaleconomics.modernmedicine.com/medical-economics/content/tags/career-advice/moonlighting-physicians-expand-income-experience-taking?page=full http://medicaleconomics.modernmedicine.com/medical-economics...
- xienze 9y ago
  To add to that, a lot of doctors at urgent care clinics (after hours, at least) are moonlighting.
- alistairSH 9y ago
  Unless I missed it, that report doesn't indicate the total hours worked, only rates at which doctors perform work outside their primary clinical job. There is also a massive difference between a doctor taking a side job because they enjoy it and a WalMart associate taking a delivery job because they have no choice.
  - phamilton 9y ago
    > 35% of internists reported earning income from sources other than their primary practice > There is also a massive difference between a doctor taking a side job because they enjoy it and a WalMart associate taking a delivery job because they have no choice. I suggest you become more familiar with what medical interns get paid and their lifestyle. They are certainly moonlighting to pay the bills.
    - mtberatwork 9y ago
      Internist as in "internal medicine", not as in "unpaid intern".
      - alistairSH 9y ago
        In the US, we have medical interns. They have completed their classroom studies, but not yet started residencies. They typically work as poorly paid interns for 18 months(?), doing quick rotations through the various specialties, before moving on to their residencies. They are paid poorly. I think the base rate is about $35k/year. But, at this point, they are still effectively students. I believe the MD is granted upon completion of the internship (or maybe they have the MD, but not the license to practice, I can never remember).
        ghostly_s 9y ago
        Ugh. Internist is not a synonym for intern, unpaid or otherwise. An 'internist' is a sub-specialty of fully-licensed medical doctor, as in 'internal medicine'. It's equivalent to a pediatrician except specifically focused on care for adult patients, in contrast to a 'family practice' or 'general practice' doctor, who focuses on both adult and pediatric patients.
- ghostly_s 9y ago
  I'm pretty skeptical of the level to which they've dived into these results. 43% of the respondents said they receive supplemental income from "other medical" work. There exists a massive network of funding backed by pharmaceutical companies which essentially launders money into the pockets of physicians through things like highly-paid consultancy roles, speaking engagements, etc. Ostensibly these types of things would be covered by the 'speaking engagement' and 'consulting' categories, but the low figures there do not jive with my anecdotal knowledge of the field so I'm not really willing to accept these self-reported results as accurate considering that massive "other" result. Just looking at the figures as presented, it seems the average rate of moonlighting is in the range of 34%, and of the types of moonlighting reported, I'd only characterize about 37% as direct medical practice. So that adds up to 13% of practitioners who are actually practicing medicine somewhere else in their free time. Not unheard of, but far from the norm, so I stand by my point. The great majority of doctors are not picking up shifts somewhere else, because the great majority of them don't need the extra income.
smileysteve 9y ago
Beyond Doctors, a lot of software engineers are highly paid and moonlight as well. Or startup founders driving for uber.
- frik 9y ago
  > Or startup founders driving for uber. So it really happens? I though it was joke in "Silicon Valley" TV series S04E01.
EpicEng 9y ago
Well I guess just making things up is one approach to debate, eh?

Chaebixi 9y ago

> Coming from Walmart's perspective, I'm assuming it just seemed like a smart business decision rather than something maliciously intended. I think that's exactly what the parent comment was criticizing: >> Ugh. I think that this sort of attitude (which was my initial reaction too) is a big part of what's wrong with our current economy. To restate: what's wrong with our economy is that we evaluate things, first and foremost, on if they're a "smart business decision" or not. That leads to "smart business decisions" are shady when looked at from many other perspectives.

hdhdjjdjd7773 9y ago

Let's not compare economic apples and oranges Doctors don't make minimum wage Why should most employees who could be better off if Walmart just paid more spend MORE time working to support Walmarts interests Because they don't have any other real options. That's the real manipulation Doctors on the other hand can drop out of medicine and have life experiences and/or education to take them in a number of directions