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I'm just sick of hearing about it. This is like the OJ Simpson trial of hacker news. Or I should say Reddit. The responses here were fairly normal until someon

I'm just sick of hearing about it. This is like the OJ Simpson trial of hacker news. Or I should say Reddit. The responses here were fairly normal until someone pointed out that reddit-ers were freaking out about it. I really hate to beat the old 'reddit is teh dumb' dead horse, but it kind of seems like it sometimes. I think someone read into that essay what he wanted in a search for controversy, and then a lot of people jumped on the bandwagon in order to grind an axe with PG or YC, or to appear politically correct, or any number of other reasons. It's just like when the whole world had a cow over the (lack of) unicode support in Arc0. I am currently a caged lion, and I feel like one. I dream of nothing else but the open savanna and a tasty gazelle. How is that for taking a metaphor too far? I understood the whole thing as "startups are liberating to hackers" ... not "hackers that aren't doing startups suck" as others have suggested. I think his points about giant organizations not being natural make sense, and I really don't see why everyone took it personally. Sure, people can enjoy their big company jobs. But you have to wonder... I have yet to meet an (ex)entrepreneur that hated running his own business. Just because you happen to like your company job doesn't mean you wouldn't get more done and feel more free in a startup. And just because you would get more done and feel more free in a startup doesn't mean you should quit a company job you are happy at either. It's up to the individual. It's not like we are arguing over religion here. Or are we? It sure sounds like it lately.

deleted 19y ago
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pius 19y ago
I agree. I'm embarrassed for the people who are projecting their insecurities on the article.
pg 19y ago
The situation with reddit is a unique one. I think I'm the only person who both writes a lot and started a news site. Not surprisingly, people who like what I write tended to switch to that news site. The switch was particularly extreme in the case of reddit, because News.YC is in a sense an offshoot of reddit: most people who switched from another site to this one came from there. The result is that practically anyone left on reddit who has an opinion about me has a bad one. At this point, I could write an essay saying 1 + 1 = 2, and the reddit comment thread would be pretty unanimous that I was mistaken, and moreover, an asshole for saying so. Usually this doesn't effect anything much, but I think you're right that it did in this case. I exchanged email with Atwood and it seemed clear he'd been influenced by the tone of the reddit thread. I don't think there's anything one could actually do about this problem. I only mention this because it is so far as I know a novel one.
- xlnt 19y ago
  Of course there is something you could do. People aren't static. So what if the people who like you came here, and the ones who didn't stayed there? If you say good enough things everyone will like you and it will be a mute point. Sure it's harder because there is some initial negative reaction to overcome from the reddit group. And it may not be the best use of your time. But it could be done with sufficient skill.
  - gruseom 19y ago
    If you say good enough things everyone will like you Oh my goodness. You're not serious, are you? This is a strategy for obtaining misery and contempt... and deserving it!
    - xlnt 19y ago
      I am serious. What do you think could possibly prevent this from working (other than insufficient skill to say good enough things)? You say it's a strategy for obtaining misery and contempt. But it's not a strategy. It's just a fact. The strategy of attempting to get everyone to like you in this way is something different. That's hard and I didn't recommend it, I only said it is possible.
      - gruseom 19y ago
        What do you think could possibly prevent this from working The people you're trying to please have contradictory opinions and desires. What you say to please Group A will strike Group B as an outrage! And if you try to remove everything potentially offensive to anybody, well, that will turn you into such a pandering namby-pamb that the whole world will find you annoying and want to poke you with a stick. Edit: Just to be clear, I'm not saying one should go around offending people. I'm saying that trying to get everyone to like you is hopeless and that effort put into doing so will both warp and weaken you. Other edit: just noticed that pchristensen already made the same point.
        19y ago

deleted 19y ago

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pius 19y ago

I agree. I'm embarrassed for the people who are projecting their insecurities on the article.

pg 19y ago

The situation with reddit is a unique one. I think I'm the only person who both writes a lot and started a news site. Not surprisingly, people who like what I write tended to switch to that news site. The switch was particularly extreme in the case of reddit, because News.YC is in a sense an offshoot of reddit: most people who switched from another site to this one came from there. The result is that practically anyone left on reddit who has an opinion about me has a bad one. At this point, I could write an essay saying 1 + 1 = 2, and the reddit comment thread would be pretty unanimous that I was mistaken, and moreover, an asshole for saying so. Usually this doesn't effect anything much, but I think you're right that it did in this case. I exchanged email with Atwood and it seemed clear he'd been influenced by the tone of the reddit thread. I don't think there's anything one could actually do about this problem. I only mention this because it is so far as I know a novel one.

xlnt 19y ago
Of course there is something you could do. People aren't static. So what if the people who like you came here, and the ones who didn't stayed there? If you say good enough things everyone will like you and it will be a mute point. Sure it's harder because there is some initial negative reaction to overcome from the reddit group. And it may not be the best use of your time. But it could be done with sufficient skill.
- gruseom 19y ago
  If you say good enough things everyone will like you Oh my goodness. You're not serious, are you? This is a strategy for obtaining misery and contempt... and deserving it!
  - xlnt 19y ago
    I am serious. What do you think could possibly prevent this from working (other than insufficient skill to say good enough things)? You say it's a strategy for obtaining misery and contempt. But it's not a strategy. It's just a fact. The strategy of attempting to get everyone to like you in this way is something different. That's hard and I didn't recommend it, I only said it is possible.
    - gruseom 19y ago
      What do you think could possibly prevent this from working The people you're trying to please have contradictory opinions and desires. What you say to please Group A will strike Group B as an outrage! And if you try to remove everything potentially offensive to anybody, well, that will turn you into such a pandering namby-pamb that the whole world will find you annoying and want to poke you with a stick. Edit: Just to be clear, I'm not saying one should go around offending people. I'm saying that trying to get everyone to like you is hopeless and that effort put into doing so will both warp and weaken you. Other edit: just noticed that pchristensen already made the same point.
      - 19y ago