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All of the government's attempts to address this excessive overwork just seems lackluster. > Earlier this year the government introduced 'Premium Fridays', enc

by zhemao 9y ago

All of the government's attempts to address this excessive overwork just seems lackluster. > Earlier this year the government introduced 'Premium Fridays', encouraging firms to let their employees out early, at 3pm, on the last Friday each month. They also want Japanese workers to take more holiday. That's a single digit number of hours every month. It's meaningless if workers are still doing massive amounts of unpaid overtime. > Earlier this year the government proposed limiting average overtime to 60 hours a month though firms would be allowed to up this to 100 hours during "busy periods" - well into the karoshi red zone. And suddenly every period is a "busy period". > Critics say the government is prioritizing business and economic interests at the expense of the welfare of workers. Not even. I'm sure they could actually be more productive if they weren't literally working their employees to death. Here's an idea. Make companies pay extra compensation if employees work overtime. I guarantee you companies will be literally pushing their employees out the door at 6 PM then.

meric 9y ago
single digit number At least it's likely a high single digit.
patio11 9y ago
Make companies pay extra compensation if employees work overtime. This is the standard practice at many (but not all) Japanese companies with an overtime culture. "Service overtime" (サービス残業) -- uncompensated overtime -- is widely perceived to be abusive, and the abusiveness of this practice is deployed by defenders of the status quo as "We're not abusive; we paid every one of those 80 hours at time and a quarter." It's priced into the expectations, literally -- my offer letter from my previous employer in Japan had two columns in it, the "formal offer" and the "offer assuming overtime pay[+]", with the number quoted at me being the total salary inclusive of their estimate of overtime. (30 hours of compensated overtime a month.) (This was... ahem... an optimistic estimate.)
- rimliu 9y ago
  I was going to ask "optimistic-in what way?" but then I realised that 30hours a month makes for about 1.5hour a day, so the number of overtime hours was most likely very underestimated…
- zhemao 9y ago
  So then why do they do it? Why would you pay 1.25x per hour worked when you could hire more employees and have everyone work normal hours. It's one thing to have crunch time. It's another for excessive overtime to be the normal way of doing things.
  - watwut 9y ago
    As far as they are concerned, this is normal hours.
- gerbal 9y ago
  So Japan has issues with a poor job market and people working themselves to death? It seems like raising the mandatory pay rate for overtime would really reduce the issue. A sliding scale that increases the overtime pay rate for additional hours would nip this in the bud and improve the labor market. Something like 1.5x for > 50 hours/week and 2x for >60 hours /week would put tremendous pressure on companies to hire more staff rather than working their employees to death. Also it wouldn't nuke the salaries of those depending on overtime pay to make ends meet. Fewer overtime hours, same pay.
euske 9y ago
> Here's an idea. Make companies pay extra compensation if employees work overtime. I guarantee you companies will be literally pushing their employees out the door at 6 PM then. Most companies already do pay extra compensation for overtime, at least in theory. The reality is that there's an informal pressure for employees not to declare their overwork time or they could use various loopholes that make them technically "not overwork". Officially, Japanese labor laws look pretty good on paper. In Japan, most obstacles are informal which apparently the government can't really regulate.
- fffernan 9y ago
  And that's exactly why the foreigners get away with it. Can't follow unwritten rules you don't know.
- fffernan 9y ago
  And that's exactly why the foreigners get away with it. Can't follow unwritten rules you don't know.
matthewbadeau 9y ago
'Premium Fridays' are a bit of a joke in Japan and many people aren't even participating. When they do participate, it's only under the presumption that employees will take their holiday time off. It isn't even free to the employees. Here's an article[0] that promotes "Premium Fridays" that states: > [The] Ministry of Economy, Trade and Industry, which is pushing the idea, hasn’t decided yet if its officials will get to join in. [0]http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2017/01/02/national/bid-curb-long-working-hours-ministry-plans-roll-premium-friday-campaign/#.WTD6k2iGOUk http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2017/01/02/national/bid-cur...
laurieg 9y ago
Premium Friday is a strange kind of a joke. It's far too little, and no one follows it anyway. I'm in a startup in Japan. Our offices are in offices provided by the city to encourage startups. I don't know anyone who is doing premium Friday here. I held a little party for the first premium Friday. A few people came at 3pm, but everyone went back to work after.

by zhemao 9y ago

meric 9y ago

single digit number At least it's likely a high single digit.

patio11 9y ago

Make companies pay extra compensation if employees work overtime. This is the standard practice at many (but not all) Japanese companies with an overtime culture. "Service overtime" (サービス残業) -- uncompensated overtime -- is widely perceived to be abusive, and the abusiveness of this practice is deployed by defenders of the status quo as "We're not abusive; we paid every one of those 80 hours at time and a quarter." It's priced into the expectations, literally -- my offer letter from my previous employer in Japan had two columns in it, the "formal offer" and the "offer assuming overtime pay[+]", with the number quoted at me being the total salary inclusive of their estimate of overtime. (30 hours of compensated overtime a month.) (This was... ahem... an optimistic estimate.)

rimliu 9y ago
I was going to ask "optimistic-in what way?" but then I realised that 30hours a month makes for about 1.5hour a day, so the number of overtime hours was most likely very underestimated…
zhemao 9y ago
So then why do they do it? Why would you pay 1.25x per hour worked when you could hire more employees and have everyone work normal hours. It's one thing to have crunch time. It's another for excessive overtime to be the normal way of doing things.
- watwut 9y ago
  As far as they are concerned, this is normal hours.
gerbal 9y ago
So Japan has issues with a poor job market and people working themselves to death? It seems like raising the mandatory pay rate for overtime would really reduce the issue. A sliding scale that increases the overtime pay rate for additional hours would nip this in the bud and improve the labor market. Something like 1.5x for > 50 hours/week and 2x for >60 hours /week would put tremendous pressure on companies to hire more staff rather than working their employees to death. Also it wouldn't nuke the salaries of those depending on overtime pay to make ends meet. Fewer overtime hours, same pay.

euske 9y ago

> Here's an idea. Make companies pay extra compensation if employees work overtime. I guarantee you companies will be literally pushing their employees out the door at 6 PM then. Most companies already do pay extra compensation for overtime, at least in theory. The reality is that there's an informal pressure for employees not to declare their overwork time or they could use various loopholes that make them technically "not overwork". Officially, Japanese labor laws look pretty good on paper. In Japan, most obstacles are informal which apparently the government can't really regulate.

fffernan 9y ago
And that's exactly why the foreigners get away with it. Can't follow unwritten rules you don't know.
fffernan 9y ago
And that's exactly why the foreigners get away with it. Can't follow unwritten rules you don't know.

matthewbadeau 9y ago

'Premium Fridays' are a bit of a joke in Japan and many people aren't even participating. When they do participate, it's only under the presumption that employees will take their holiday time off. It isn't even free to the employees. Here's an article[0] that promotes "Premium Fridays" that states: > [The] Ministry of Economy, Trade and Industry, which is pushing the idea, hasn’t decided yet if its officials will get to join in. [0]http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2017/01/02/national/bid-curb-long-working-hours-ministry-plans-roll-premium-friday-campaign/#.WTD6k2iGOUk http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2017/01/02/national/bid-cur...

laurieg 9y ago

Premium Friday is a strange kind of a joke. It's far too little, and no one follows it anyway. I'm in a startup in Japan. Our offices are in offices provided by the city to encourage startups. I don't know anyone who is doing premium Friday here. I held a little party for the first premium Friday. A few people came at 3pm, but everyone went back to work after.