7 ms·

As an average citizen I bunch events into the categories of 1 "Things I Can Prevent" and 2 "Things I Cannot Prevent". Opioids fall into category 1. I refuse to

As an average citizen I bunch events into the categories of 1 "Things I Can Prevent" and 2 "Things I Cannot Prevent". Opioids fall into category 1. I refuse to take any opioids even when prescribed because I do not want to go near such dangerous substances. However terrorist attacks, mass shootings, crazy people, etc fall into category 2. Category 2 frightens me quite a bit more than category 1. I'm willing to bet that a ton of people feel the same way as me. And that's probably why issues like terrorism get a ton of air time and issues like opioids get very little.

prklmn 9y ago
Many people who end up taking opioids say the same thing you say, and swear them off. It's easy to say that you won't take them until you're in pain that makes you feel as if you're dying, then it's a different story.
- oculusthrift 9y ago
  yeah but not all the people taking them are in that sort of pain. most are just ordinary drug addicted people
  - acover 9y ago
    Source? From what I have read the major cause of the opioid crisis is doctors prescribing opioids for pain [0]. Even 2 week prescriptions have 25% chance of creating an addict [1]. Remember originally these were marketed to doctors as non-addictive. [0] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opioid_crisis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opioid_crisis [1] - https://arstechnica.com/science/2017/03/with-a-10-day-supply-of-opioids-1-in-5-become-long-term-users/ https://arstechnica.com/science/2017/03/with-a-10-day-supply...
    - MaysonL 9y ago
      And the major cause of doctors prescribing opioids for pain is: Purdue Pharma propaganda and bribes. [0][1] [0]http://theweek.com/articles/541564/how-american-opiate-epidemic-started-by-pharmaceutical-company http://theweek.com/articles/541564/how-american-opiate-epide... [1]https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2622774/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2622774/ title: "The Promotion and Marketing of OxyContin: Commercial Triumph, Public Health Tragedy"
lazyasciiart 9y ago
Where do road accidents fall? Do you just avoid being on roads?
- nine_k 9y ago
  Living in a large dense city where cars move slowly and most people use rapid transit goes a long way towards this. (And also costs you.)
  - CydeWeys 9y ago
    If you don't need a lot of space, i.e. you don't have kids and you can handle having roommates, then it doesn't really cost more to live in a big city. Sure, the rent is more, but not having to pay for an auto loan/gasoline/insurance saves a good amount too. Source: I moved from the suburbs of DC in MD to Manhattan, I track my spending pretty religiously on Mint, and my spending only went up a few $K per year -- which is way, way less than my salary did from the move.
    - hiram112 9y ago
      Are you saying the engineering / dev salaries in NYC are outpacing DC? I see DC creeping up to $160K-$170K or so for senior devs that can negotiate. What are you seeing in Manhattan?
      - CydeWeys 9y ago
        I'm earning over double that in Manhattan as a senior SWE (at the big G). We have no real eng presence in DC.
    - nine_k 9y ago
      I work on Manhattan and live in Brooklyn, with family and kids. I still reap most of the benefits of a dense city (subway, nearly everything within walking distance, variety of options in food, etc), while spending < 20% of my income on rent.
- 9y ago
evanlivingston 9y ago
Opoid issues get quite a bit of press in midwestern newspapers. In my experience it gets more press than terrorism. How can you prevent crazy people? I'm asking because I often wonder what price we're willing to pay to make to make the chances of killed by another person 0%. Is there anyway to acheive that without creating a police state with zero privacy and zero possibility of dissent? If we start editing people's genes so they aren't "crazy" who decides what the legalized normative behaviour is?
- ajmurmann 9y ago
  I'm not sure labeling as "crazy" is fair or helpful. These substances are addictive and many people got them prescribed by their doctor whom they trusted. Lab experiments with rats might be pointing is towards what we have to do to mitigate this at least somewhat. Experiments showed that rats in a healthy social environment are much less prone to opioid addiction than ones living in isolation or having lived in isolation. See https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rat_Park https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rat_Park. I finds it easy to imagine that the same is true to some degree for humans. I wouldn't be surprised if the effect was even stronger on humans. We are very social animals after all.
  - dsfyu404ed 9y ago
    "My life was great before I got addicted" said no drug addict ever.
    - DanBC 9y ago
      You don't know many addicts right? Especially in the US the opioid addiction epidemic is caused mostly by doctor. Last year less than 1% of the population tried heroin or opium poppy. A bit more than 5% of the population tried opioids.
      - MaysonL 9y ago
        Especially in the US the opioid addiction epidemic is caused mostly by doctor. And doctor prescription is caused mainly by drug company.
ComputerGuru 9y ago
I'm sure you already know, but it's completely irrational to fear the things out of your control. There's literally nothing to be accomplished by doing so.
- mrep 9y ago
  A: Most things are not completely out of our control so it is possible to mitigate those risks. B: People are not perfectly rational. However, I totally agree with your main point.
- Banthum 9y ago
  But terror attacks aren't out of your control. For example, on a policy level, Japan never has them. They just don't immigrate any of the religious group who might commit terrorist attacks. So it's a non-issue. And on a personal level, you can mitigate terror attack risks. Just avoid gatherings of people, basically. You can go as far as you want with this - living off-grid in the forest makes you pretty much fully insulated from terrorist attacks. So the only question remaining on a personal and policy level is what the cost/benefit is for various things you could do to prevent terrorist attacks. This is a common mistake. People like to think that some options are impossible, or some gains are free. Thinking this way makes decisions easier; it makes you feel more secure in your opinions. In reality, everything is possible, and everything costs.
  - thinkling 9y ago
    > Japan never has them cough https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tokyo_subway_sarin_attack https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tokyo_subway_sarin_attack
  - lprubin 9y ago
    I wonder if the reason Japan doesn't have terror attacks is because their military does not deploy outside of their own country (other than UN peacekeeping and humanitarian efforts) and therefore doesn't create terrorist level animosity towards their country and people?

prklmn 9y ago

Many people who end up taking opioids say the same thing you say, and swear them off. It's easy to say that you won't take them until you're in pain that makes you feel as if you're dying, then it's a different story.

oculusthrift 9y ago
yeah but not all the people taking them are in that sort of pain. most are just ordinary drug addicted people
- acover 9y ago
  Source? From what I have read the major cause of the opioid crisis is doctors prescribing opioids for pain [0]. Even 2 week prescriptions have 25% chance of creating an addict [1]. Remember originally these were marketed to doctors as non-addictive. [0] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opioid_crisis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opioid_crisis [1] - https://arstechnica.com/science/2017/03/with-a-10-day-supply-of-opioids-1-in-5-become-long-term-users/ https://arstechnica.com/science/2017/03/with-a-10-day-supply...
  - MaysonL 9y ago
    And the major cause of doctors prescribing opioids for pain is: Purdue Pharma propaganda and bribes. [0][1] [0]http://theweek.com/articles/541564/how-american-opiate-epidemic-started-by-pharmaceutical-company http://theweek.com/articles/541564/how-american-opiate-epide... [1]https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2622774/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2622774/ title: "The Promotion and Marketing of OxyContin: Commercial Triumph, Public Health Tragedy"

lazyasciiart 9y ago

Where do road accidents fall? Do you just avoid being on roads?

nine_k 9y ago
Living in a large dense city where cars move slowly and most people use rapid transit goes a long way towards this. (And also costs you.)
- CydeWeys 9y ago
  If you don't need a lot of space, i.e. you don't have kids and you can handle having roommates, then it doesn't really cost more to live in a big city. Sure, the rent is more, but not having to pay for an auto loan/gasoline/insurance saves a good amount too. Source: I moved from the suburbs of DC in MD to Manhattan, I track my spending pretty religiously on Mint, and my spending only went up a few $K per year -- which is way, way less than my salary did from the move.
  - hiram112 9y ago
    Are you saying the engineering / dev salaries in NYC are outpacing DC? I see DC creeping up to $160K-$170K or so for senior devs that can negotiate. What are you seeing in Manhattan?
    - CydeWeys 9y ago
      I'm earning over double that in Manhattan as a senior SWE (at the big G). We have no real eng presence in DC.
  - nine_k 9y ago
    I work on Manhattan and live in Brooklyn, with family and kids. I still reap most of the benefits of a dense city (subway, nearly everything within walking distance, variety of options in food, etc), while spending < 20% of my income on rent.
9y ago

evanlivingston 9y ago

Opoid issues get quite a bit of press in midwestern newspapers. In my experience it gets more press than terrorism. How can you prevent crazy people? I'm asking because I often wonder what price we're willing to pay to make to make the chances of killed by another person 0%. Is there anyway to acheive that without creating a police state with zero privacy and zero possibility of dissent? If we start editing people's genes so they aren't "crazy" who decides what the legalized normative behaviour is?

ajmurmann 9y ago
I'm not sure labeling as "crazy" is fair or helpful. These substances are addictive and many people got them prescribed by their doctor whom they trusted. Lab experiments with rats might be pointing is towards what we have to do to mitigate this at least somewhat. Experiments showed that rats in a healthy social environment are much less prone to opioid addiction than ones living in isolation or having lived in isolation. See https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rat_Park https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rat_Park. I finds it easy to imagine that the same is true to some degree for humans. I wouldn't be surprised if the effect was even stronger on humans. We are very social animals after all.
- dsfyu404ed 9y ago
  "My life was great before I got addicted" said no drug addict ever.
  - DanBC 9y ago
    You don't know many addicts right? Especially in the US the opioid addiction epidemic is caused mostly by doctor. Last year less than 1% of the population tried heroin or opium poppy. A bit more than 5% of the population tried opioids.
    - MaysonL 9y ago
      Especially in the US the opioid addiction epidemic is caused mostly by doctor. And doctor prescription is caused mainly by drug company.

ComputerGuru 9y ago

I'm sure you already know, but it's completely irrational to fear the things out of your control. There's literally nothing to be accomplished by doing so.

mrep 9y ago
A: Most things are not completely out of our control so it is possible to mitigate those risks. B: People are not perfectly rational. However, I totally agree with your main point.
Banthum 9y ago
But terror attacks aren't out of your control. For example, on a policy level, Japan never has them. They just don't immigrate any of the religious group who might commit terrorist attacks. So it's a non-issue. And on a personal level, you can mitigate terror attack risks. Just avoid gatherings of people, basically. You can go as far as you want with this - living off-grid in the forest makes you pretty much fully insulated from terrorist attacks. So the only question remaining on a personal and policy level is what the cost/benefit is for various things you could do to prevent terrorist attacks. This is a common mistake. People like to think that some options are impossible, or some gains are free. Thinking this way makes decisions easier; it makes you feel more secure in your opinions. In reality, everything is possible, and everything costs.
- thinkling 9y ago
  > Japan never has them cough https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tokyo_subway_sarin_attack https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tokyo_subway_sarin_attack
- lprubin 9y ago
  I wonder if the reason Japan doesn't have terror attacks is because their military does not deploy outside of their own country (other than UN peacekeeping and humanitarian efforts) and therefore doesn't create terrorist level animosity towards their country and people?