4 ms·

Can you pay your taxes with bitcoin or ethereum?

by monkmartinez 9y ago

Svekax 9y ago
No. Can you pay your taxes with stock or houses?
- j2bax 9y ago
  Are stocks and houses aspiring to someday replace fiat currency?
  - sambe 9y ago
    Are Bitcoin and Ethereum?
    - ascendantlogic 9y ago
      If you listen to the technoliberterians on the respective subreddits, BTC and ETH will destroy all fiat and central banking. The realists realize that is highly unlikely.
      - monkmartinez 9y ago
        Thank you, this is exactly what my rhetorical question was aiming for. If BTC/ETH are investments, fine... that is a world away from currency.
        ascendantlogic 9y ago
        I have no doubt they will eventually be used as a class of currency. Thinking they will replace/destroy fiat currencies that have been around for hundreds of years is a bit of a stretch though.
        wruza 9y ago
        At this point, I think we need to define a "currency". I googled it, and wikipedia (what else?) told me that: "Currency in the most specific use of the word refers to money in any form when in actual use or circulation as a medium of exchange, especially circulating banknotes and coins." Also in Investopedia: "Currency is a generally accepted form of money, including coins and paper notes, which is issued by a government and circulated within an economy. Used as a medium of exchange for goods and services, currency is the basis for trade." CCs are circulating as a medium of exchange; emissions and transactions are [dis]proven by automated government (consensus of participants, iirc). What's the difference? In that uncommon "government", consisting of real demos this time?
      - Tar90 9y ago
        Destroying and replacing are very much orthogonal to each other.
akerro 9y ago
No, but you can use bitcoin or ethereum to avoid paying taxes.
- gnaritas 9y ago
  You can avoid paying taxes in any currency, including USD; it's still illegal regardless.
- ajross 9y ago
  Tax fraud can be done in dollars and euros too, it's maybe just a bit harder. Still fraud.
jerf 9y ago
You can only pay your taxes with the currency the taxing authority takes the tax in. But this does not prevent me from paying for my taxes with my labor; I just have to convert my labor into that currency first. The fact that you can't pay taxes in bitcoin or ethereum is not particularly distinguished from the fact that you can't pay for your taxes in goats, paintings, or the cleaning of clothes, nor is it particularly distinguished from the fact you can't pay United States taxes in Euros.
- monkmartinez 9y ago
  > But this does not prevent me from paying for my taxes with my labor; I just have to convert my labor into that currency first. So BTC/ETH are going to become currencies like the dollar or euro and not a painting or a goat which they are equivalent to now? Is that your position?
  - jerf 9y ago
    You are either being mendacious, or not tall enough for this ride. I assume the first.
qznc 9y ago
I cannot pay my taxes with dollars or yen either. I have to use Euros.
Nokinside 9y ago
Can you pay your taxes with Euros in the United States? Can you pay your taxes in USD in EU?
penagwin 9y ago
Anything ("real" or digital or anything at all) can be assigned a value by anybody. This value is also self assigned - if you don't think a laptop is worth 700USD like the maker says it is, you might not want to buy it. A US dollar bill is at the end of the day just a piece of paper - that is assigned a value (that constantly changes) by the market. The real question is if the currency has any value to a substantial amount of people. Obviously currency is useless if only two people in the world can use it. However as BTC is now over 2000USD/coin and you can use many payment processors (including stripe), I'd be inclined to say that it does indeed have value - and a use; your assignment of value to BTC may be lower.
- monkmartinez 9y ago
  > A US dollar bill is at the end of the day just a piece of paper - that is assigned a value (that constantly changes) by the market. Ultimately, the U.S. dollar is backed by the U.S. Military. What is bitcoin backed with?
  - gcp 9y ago
    Ultimately, the U.S. dollar is backed by the U.S. Military What does this even mean? That if the US economy crashes and dollars become worthless, the military will plunder a few countries for resources to restore it?
    - ShannonAlther 9y ago
      I think he means that the USD is valid currency for all debts, public and private, and this law is enforced by the US gov't.
      - penagwin 9y ago
        However stealing anything is illegal (in most countries). A weakness to BTC could be that it's hard to enforce that...
    - elif 9y ago
sowbug 9y ago
Transaction fees are the equivalent of taxes in Bitcoin, and until the final coin is mined in 2140, everyone pays a tax in the form of inflation. I know this isn't what you meant -- you're almost certainly asking a rhetorical question intended to point out a limitation of cryptocurrencies in general -- but participants do pay taxes to keep the Bitcoin infrastructure running.

Can you pay your taxes with bitcoin or ethereum?

Svekax 9y ago

No. Can you pay your taxes with stock or houses?

j2bax 9y ago
Are stocks and houses aspiring to someday replace fiat currency?
- sambe 9y ago
  Are Bitcoin and Ethereum?
  - ascendantlogic 9y ago
    If you listen to the technoliberterians on the respective subreddits, BTC and ETH will destroy all fiat and central banking. The realists realize that is highly unlikely.
    - monkmartinez 9y ago
      Thank you, this is exactly what my rhetorical question was aiming for. If BTC/ETH are investments, fine... that is a world away from currency.
      - ascendantlogic 9y ago
        I have no doubt they will eventually be used as a class of currency. Thinking they will replace/destroy fiat currencies that have been around for hundreds of years is a bit of a stretch though.
      - wruza 9y ago
        At this point, I think we need to define a "currency". I googled it, and wikipedia (what else?) told me that: "Currency in the most specific use of the word refers to money in any form when in actual use or circulation as a medium of exchange, especially circulating banknotes and coins." Also in Investopedia: "Currency is a generally accepted form of money, including coins and paper notes, which is issued by a government and circulated within an economy. Used as a medium of exchange for goods and services, currency is the basis for trade." CCs are circulating as a medium of exchange; emissions and transactions are [dis]proven by automated government (consensus of participants, iirc). What's the difference? In that uncommon "government", consisting of real demos this time?
    - Tar90 9y ago
      Destroying and replacing are very much orthogonal to each other.

akerro 9y ago

No, but you can use bitcoin or ethereum to avoid paying taxes.

gnaritas 9y ago
You can avoid paying taxes in any currency, including USD; it's still illegal regardless.
ajross 9y ago
Tax fraud can be done in dollars and euros too, it's maybe just a bit harder. Still fraud.

jerf 9y ago

You can only pay your taxes with the currency the taxing authority takes the tax in. But this does not prevent me from paying for my taxes with my labor; I just have to convert my labor into that currency first. The fact that you can't pay taxes in bitcoin or ethereum is not particularly distinguished from the fact that you can't pay for your taxes in goats, paintings, or the cleaning of clothes, nor is it particularly distinguished from the fact you can't pay United States taxes in Euros.

monkmartinez 9y ago
> But this does not prevent me from paying for my taxes with my labor; I just have to convert my labor into that currency first. So BTC/ETH are going to become currencies like the dollar or euro and not a painting or a goat which they are equivalent to now? Is that your position?
- jerf 9y ago
  You are either being mendacious, or not tall enough for this ride. I assume the first.

qznc 9y ago

I cannot pay my taxes with dollars or yen either. I have to use Euros.

Nokinside 9y ago

Can you pay your taxes with Euros in the United States? Can you pay your taxes in USD in EU?

penagwin 9y ago

Anything ("real" or digital or anything at all) can be assigned a value by anybody. This value is also self assigned - if you don't think a laptop is worth 700USD like the maker says it is, you might not want to buy it. A US dollar bill is at the end of the day just a piece of paper - that is assigned a value (that constantly changes) by the market. The real question is if the currency has any value to a substantial amount of people. Obviously currency is useless if only two people in the world can use it. However as BTC is now over 2000USD/coin and you can use many payment processors (including stripe), I'd be inclined to say that it does indeed have value - and a use; your assignment of value to BTC may be lower.

monkmartinez 9y ago
> A US dollar bill is at the end of the day just a piece of paper - that is assigned a value (that constantly changes) by the market. Ultimately, the U.S. dollar is backed by the U.S. Military. What is bitcoin backed with?
- gcp 9y ago
  Ultimately, the U.S. dollar is backed by the U.S. Military What does this even mean? That if the US economy crashes and dollars become worthless, the military will plunder a few countries for resources to restore it?
  - ShannonAlther 9y ago
    I think he means that the USD is valid currency for all debts, public and private, and this law is enforced by the US gov't.
    - penagwin 9y ago
      However stealing anything is illegal (in most countries). A weakness to BTC could be that it's hard to enforce that...
  - elif 9y ago

sowbug 9y ago

Transaction fees are the equivalent of taxes in Bitcoin, and until the final coin is mined in 2140, everyone pays a tax in the form of inflation. I know this isn't what you meant -- you're almost certainly asking a rhetorical question intended to point out a limitation of cryptocurrencies in general -- but participants do pay taxes to keep the Bitcoin infrastructure running.