4 ms·

How many people drive more than 300km regularly? Even in the US, I doubt it's actually that many.

r00fus 9y ago
Well, the calculation I made is to put 150% of my highest most recent daily usage - i.e., commute + pickup kids + store + random errand. Combined with wear/tear range reduction, I add a buffer of 50% so reduce advertise range by 1/3 for "usable range". So 200km*1/3 is somewhere around my comfortable range. That might be higher for other folks...
YSFEJ4SWJUVU6 9y ago
A car that gets 250 km on the European NEDC test cycl will only get 150 km when driving at leisurely highway speeds with AC loaded (for example Nissan admits to this on their very own website for the Leaf); and even less than that at actual motorway speeds. But it's all right. I mean, just for road safety you should take a 30 min break after every hour on motorway unless you're some sort of superhuman. Who could argue it's not a perfectly decent range for travelling? (edited for clarity) And you can spend that time just thinking where to invest all the money you save from oil changes.
- greglindahl 9y ago
  I don't think you'll see anyone saying that a car with 150km of actual highway range is good for long-distance trips. Which is why a bunch of carmakers are building or planning cars with much longer ranges, similar to Teslas, which are fine for road-tripping.
- KirinDave 9y ago
  Yeah uh, you don't lose 40% of your range on the AC even in a Leaf.
  - YSFEJ4SWJUVU6 9y ago
    Of course not, nor did I claim that. However, driving at highway speeds contributes the other part and these figures are pulled straight from Nissan's own web page. (The exact figures are: driving at highway averaging 88 km/h with outside temperature 30 degrees Celsius and using AC – cabin temp is not told – would give you a range of 152 km. Rated at 250 km NEDC.) Driving at highway speeds obviously isn't a big part of NEDC rating for EVs.
    - greglindahl 9y ago
      That's why nobody claims NEDC rating is useful for highway trips. You first replied to gsnedders, and I don't think he was talking about a NEDC rating, he appeared to be talking about an actual range.
      - YSFEJ4SWJUVU6 9y ago
        Maybe. I don't know. NEDC rating is what you can sort of get in slow city driving, and city driving is what a car with that sort of range is made for.
        greglindahl 9y ago
        We were talking about cars with 200km-300km of actual range... the whole point of the discussion is that newer electric cars have significantly improved range compared to the previous generation.
    - KirinDave 9y ago
      I think Nissan's being a bit conservative there. But I deliberately avoided the Leaf because it's such a first gen car. The Leaf is much worse off than the Bolt or even a 500e when it comes to this. My bolt, I've worked out it is about a 7% range loss using A/C on those hot MtV 280 commutes. I've driven to Watsonville then back to SF in one day and been comfortably in my range in a Bolt. So... it's getting good very fast. I really do like my car.
- linkregister 9y ago
  > What do you think: do inconvenient facts go away with a down vote? Whining about internet points is annoying. I agree that a Leaf isn't practical for longer trips. EV viability will improve with easier access to rental cars for longer trips. Zipcar doesn't have the coverage necessary to do this in most cities. Maybe Getaround will improve to the point where it's practical. I consider most EVs to be equivalent to being 100% reliant on public transit; good for commutes, but unacceptable for recreation. And that's okay.
- cr0sh 9y ago
  > I mean, just for road safety you should take a 30 min break after every hour on motorway unless you're some sort of superhuman. No need for being a "superhuman". All you need is plenty of Mountain Dew, a gas station burrito, a few No-Doz, the window rolled down and the music turned up! The miles just fly by. I've easily done 10 hour, 800 mile trips only stopping for gas once or twice. I'll grant that was in the past when I was younger, but even today two or three hours at a stretch would be no problem (heck, just to drive from here in Phoenix to Tuscon would take that long - why stop?). > And you can spend that time just thinking where to invest all the money you save from oil changes. I do my own oil changes, and maybe spend a grand total of a few hundred dollars a year doing them. Honestly, I probably spend more on fast food per year (now that is really something I would love to drop - if only it wasn't so tasty at times).
mahyarm 9y ago
It's about round trips in large cities. For example, if I want to drive from san jose to sf and then come back that is about 220km in one day for 2 hours on the highway.
- KirinDave 9y ago
  I drive SF to SJ on the reg in a Bolt. With a 220 charger I recover charge overnight. My other commute is SF to Mountain View, I can recover that at night with a standard outlet set to 12A mode. That's well within the range of most electric vehicles on the market.
irrational 9y ago
What is regularly? We probably take 2 road trips of 3500km a year, probably 4 trips of 1000km a year, and probably 10 trips of 350km a year. In the Western US things are very spread out. We live in a city of nearly 3 million people, but the next three closest cities of comparable or larger size are 300km, 700km, and 1000 km away. And if your wondering why we don't fly, it's because we have 7 children so it's cheaper to drive.
- gsnedders 9y ago
  > What is regularly? That's really the relevant point here: at what point do the savings of an electric car make it such that renting another car for the longer trips still ends up with that coming out on top? There's definitely a long tail of people who drive further regularly for whom electric cars won't be so practical.
jcranmer 9y ago
I think nothing of a 250km one-way jaunt--to go to supper with family on Easter. On average, every other month, I either make that trip or a 1000km one-way trip. When I was younger and did a lot of camping, a 300km jaunt (again, one-way) for a monthly camping trip was typical. 300km is a bit much for a commute (I've only had a 50km one-way commute personally, although I do know a few people with 100km commutes), but it's not really that far for a trip you might take on a 3-day weekend to the beach or the mountains. The US really is that large: I might describe myself as living "close" to Chicago since it's the closest city that most people stand a chance of putting on a map, but it's basically as far away as Brussels is from Paris.
- Johnny555 9y ago
  My wife and I have a small hybrid commuter car (we'd probably have an EV if we could reasonably install a charger at our Condo). When we go on a significant trip, we generally rent a bigger car or minivan for a more comfortable trip. We get the advantage of an easy to park and fuel efficient car for the daily commute, but also can take advantage of a larger car for the big trips.

Well, the calculation I made is to put 150% of my highest most recent daily usage - i.e., commute + pickup kids + store + random errand. Combined with wear/tear range reduction, I add a buffer of 50% so reduce advertise range by 1/3 for "usable range". So 200km*1/3 is somewhere around my comfortable range. That might be higher for other folks...

YSFEJ4SWJUVU6 9y ago

A car that gets 250 km on the European NEDC test cycl will only get 150 km when driving at leisurely highway speeds with AC loaded (for example Nissan admits to this on their very own website for the Leaf); and even less than that at actual motorway speeds. But it's all right. I mean, just for road safety you should take a 30 min break after every hour on motorway unless you're some sort of superhuman. Who could argue it's not a perfectly decent range for travelling? (edited for clarity) And you can spend that time just thinking where to invest all the money you save from oil changes.

greglindahl 9y ago
I don't think you'll see anyone saying that a car with 150km of actual highway range is good for long-distance trips. Which is why a bunch of carmakers are building or planning cars with much longer ranges, similar to Teslas, which are fine for road-tripping.
KirinDave 9y ago
Yeah uh, you don't lose 40% of your range on the AC even in a Leaf.
- YSFEJ4SWJUVU6 9y ago
  Of course not, nor did I claim that. However, driving at highway speeds contributes the other part and these figures are pulled straight from Nissan's own web page. (The exact figures are: driving at highway averaging 88 km/h with outside temperature 30 degrees Celsius and using AC – cabin temp is not told – would give you a range of 152 km. Rated at 250 km NEDC.) Driving at highway speeds obviously isn't a big part of NEDC rating for EVs.
  - greglindahl 9y ago
    That's why nobody claims NEDC rating is useful for highway trips. You first replied to gsnedders, and I don't think he was talking about a NEDC rating, he appeared to be talking about an actual range.
    - YSFEJ4SWJUVU6 9y ago
      Maybe. I don't know. NEDC rating is what you can sort of get in slow city driving, and city driving is what a car with that sort of range is made for.
      - greglindahl 9y ago
        We were talking about cars with 200km-300km of actual range... the whole point of the discussion is that newer electric cars have significantly improved range compared to the previous generation.
  - KirinDave 9y ago
    I think Nissan's being a bit conservative there. But I deliberately avoided the Leaf because it's such a first gen car. The Leaf is much worse off than the Bolt or even a 500e when it comes to this. My bolt, I've worked out it is about a 7% range loss using A/C on those hot MtV 280 commutes. I've driven to Watsonville then back to SF in one day and been comfortably in my range in a Bolt. So... it's getting good very fast. I really do like my car.
linkregister 9y ago
> What do you think: do inconvenient facts go away with a down vote? Whining about internet points is annoying. I agree that a Leaf isn't practical for longer trips. EV viability will improve with easier access to rental cars for longer trips. Zipcar doesn't have the coverage necessary to do this in most cities. Maybe Getaround will improve to the point where it's practical. I consider most EVs to be equivalent to being 100% reliant on public transit; good for commutes, but unacceptable for recreation. And that's okay.
cr0sh 9y ago
> I mean, just for road safety you should take a 30 min break after every hour on motorway unless you're some sort of superhuman. No need for being a "superhuman". All you need is plenty of Mountain Dew, a gas station burrito, a few No-Doz, the window rolled down and the music turned up! The miles just fly by. I've easily done 10 hour, 800 mile trips only stopping for gas once or twice. I'll grant that was in the past when I was younger, but even today two or three hours at a stretch would be no problem (heck, just to drive from here in Phoenix to Tuscon would take that long - why stop?). > And you can spend that time just thinking where to invest all the money you save from oil changes. I do my own oil changes, and maybe spend a grand total of a few hundred dollars a year doing them. Honestly, I probably spend more on fast food per year (now that is really something I would love to drop - if only it wasn't so tasty at times).

mahyarm 9y ago

It's about round trips in large cities. For example, if I want to drive from san jose to sf and then come back that is about 220km in one day for 2 hours on the highway.

KirinDave 9y ago
I drive SF to SJ on the reg in a Bolt. With a 220 charger I recover charge overnight. My other commute is SF to Mountain View, I can recover that at night with a standard outlet set to 12A mode. That's well within the range of most electric vehicles on the market.

irrational 9y ago

What is regularly? We probably take 2 road trips of 3500km a year, probably 4 trips of 1000km a year, and probably 10 trips of 350km a year. In the Western US things are very spread out. We live in a city of nearly 3 million people, but the next three closest cities of comparable or larger size are 300km, 700km, and 1000 km away. And if your wondering why we don't fly, it's because we have 7 children so it's cheaper to drive.

gsnedders 9y ago
> What is regularly? That's really the relevant point here: at what point do the savings of an electric car make it such that renting another car for the longer trips still ends up with that coming out on top? There's definitely a long tail of people who drive further regularly for whom electric cars won't be so practical.

jcranmer 9y ago

I think nothing of a 250km one-way jaunt--to go to supper with family on Easter. On average, every other month, I either make that trip or a 1000km one-way trip. When I was younger and did a lot of camping, a 300km jaunt (again, one-way) for a monthly camping trip was typical. 300km is a bit much for a commute (I've only had a 50km one-way commute personally, although I do know a few people with 100km commutes), but it's not really that far for a trip you might take on a 3-day weekend to the beach or the mountains. The US really is that large: I might describe myself as living "close" to Chicago since it's the closest city that most people stand a chance of putting on a map, but it's basically as far away as Brussels is from Paris.

Johnny555 9y ago
My wife and I have a small hybrid commuter car (we'd probably have an EV if we could reasonably install a charger at our Condo). When we go on a significant trip, we generally rent a bigger car or minivan for a more comfortable trip. We get the advantage of an easy to park and fuel efficient car for the daily commute, but also can take advantage of a larger car for the big trips.