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I disagree. The things you say may have been true decades ago, but are not entirely accurate today. The US's banking industry's reputation took a big hit in 20

by ken47 9y ago

I disagree. The things you say may have been true decades ago, but are not entirely accurate today. The US's banking industry's reputation took a big hit in 2008, and it has become increasingly common for top university students to head into tech over finance since then. Not to mention, firms like Goldman Sachs are replacing many of their traditional traders with software engineers. Outside of top law schools, the prospects of law grads have diminished greatly over the past decade or two. And some varieties of lawyers, such as patent trolls, are especially frowned upon -- the opposite of "top-tier" and "distinguished" in the eyes of many. And I don't think the pool of potential doctors and the pool of potential software engineers overlap much at all. I would guess that the number of university students deciding to be doctors instead of software engineers is quite small.

freyr 9y ago
Finance may have taken a hit recently, but if you're in the northeast (NYC, Boston, etc.), it still has much higher prestige. It also has a much, much higher compensation ceiling. The same goes for lawyers working in cities. Many law students are underemployed, but overall there's a much higher compensation ceiling. Management consultants weren't mentioned, but a large percentage of top grads end up there, being groomed for executive positions in Fortune 500 companies. Many of the Ivey League students gravitating to tech are likely envisioning themselves as founders or C-suite executives, not engineers. Outside of the SV bubble, software engineer is not a top-tier job. Nor is it a particularly well paying job. In SV though, it has prestige.
- zjaffee 9y ago
  I agree that the software engineering profession isn't one with much prestige vested into it as a profession. However, the technology industry, especially up and coming start-ups, and the established players like google,facebook, or apple are some of the most prestigious companies to work for, in some ways surpassing that of McKinsey or Goldman Sachs in the eyes of an everyday person.
- acdha 9y ago
  Also: how many of those professions simply assume that anyone good will be doing something else by the time they're in their 40s? A 50 year old lawyer or doctor might choose to be more supervisory but nobody is going to think they're a failure if they aren't, and their experience will be valued rather something they have to prove isn't holding them back. > Many of the Ivey League students gravitating to tech are likely envisioning themselves as founders or C-suite executives, not engineers. Outside of the SV bubble, software engineer is not a top-tier job. Nor is it a particularly well paying job. In SV though, it has prestige. My general rule is to follow the money, and at most companies the compensation levels don't look like engineering is a prestige position. Not bad, to be sure, but definitely outside the inner circle even at many companies where it's a core competitive attribute. This isn't new: during the dot-com bubble, there were plenty of people who got decent numbers but the people getting rich tended to be management, sales, etc. with all of the talk of “passion” and highlighting the lucky few winners looking suspiciously like a way to get people to donate enough unpaid overtime to make someone else very rich.
  - freyr 9y ago
    Exactly. In good careers, the experience that comes with time is counted as an asset. If you're in a career where you're considered washed up by 30 [1], you'd better be standing in the middle of an arena and surrounded by 80,000 screaming fans. https://venturebeat.com/2007/03/26/start-up-advice-for-entrepreneurs-from-y-combinator-startup-school/ https://venturebeat.com/2007/03/26/start-up-advice-for-entre...
johan_larson 9y ago
The things you say may have been true decades ago, but are not entirely accurate today. OK, I'll buy there's something to that. But keep in mind that students' choices aren't made purely with a clear-eyed understanding of how things are now. They are made in part based on an understanding built up over time, some of which reflects how things were when they were when growing up. In particular, parents and other advisers who have a lot of pull can easily be acting on the basis of a decades-old view of the world. So even if things are shifting, current actions could well be lagging behind.

by ken47 9y ago

freyr 9y ago

Finance may have taken a hit recently, but if you're in the northeast (NYC, Boston, etc.), it still has much higher prestige. It also has a much, much higher compensation ceiling. The same goes for lawyers working in cities. Many law students are underemployed, but overall there's a much higher compensation ceiling. Management consultants weren't mentioned, but a large percentage of top grads end up there, being groomed for executive positions in Fortune 500 companies. Many of the Ivey League students gravitating to tech are likely envisioning themselves as founders or C-suite executives, not engineers. Outside of the SV bubble, software engineer is not a top-tier job. Nor is it a particularly well paying job. In SV though, it has prestige.

zjaffee 9y ago
I agree that the software engineering profession isn't one with much prestige vested into it as a profession. However, the technology industry, especially up and coming start-ups, and the established players like google,facebook, or apple are some of the most prestigious companies to work for, in some ways surpassing that of McKinsey or Goldman Sachs in the eyes of an everyday person.
acdha 9y ago
Also: how many of those professions simply assume that anyone good will be doing something else by the time they're in their 40s? A 50 year old lawyer or doctor might choose to be more supervisory but nobody is going to think they're a failure if they aren't, and their experience will be valued rather something they have to prove isn't holding them back. > Many of the Ivey League students gravitating to tech are likely envisioning themselves as founders or C-suite executives, not engineers. Outside of the SV bubble, software engineer is not a top-tier job. Nor is it a particularly well paying job. In SV though, it has prestige. My general rule is to follow the money, and at most companies the compensation levels don't look like engineering is a prestige position. Not bad, to be sure, but definitely outside the inner circle even at many companies where it's a core competitive attribute. This isn't new: during the dot-com bubble, there were plenty of people who got decent numbers but the people getting rich tended to be management, sales, etc. with all of the talk of “passion” and highlighting the lucky few winners looking suspiciously like a way to get people to donate enough unpaid overtime to make someone else very rich.
- freyr 9y ago
  Exactly. In good careers, the experience that comes with time is counted as an asset. If you're in a career where you're considered washed up by 30 [1], you'd better be standing in the middle of an arena and surrounded by 80,000 screaming fans. https://venturebeat.com/2007/03/26/start-up-advice-for-entrepreneurs-from-y-combinator-startup-school/ https://venturebeat.com/2007/03/26/start-up-advice-for-entre...

johan_larson 9y ago

The things you say may have been true decades ago, but are not entirely accurate today. OK, I'll buy there's something to that. But keep in mind that students' choices aren't made purely with a clear-eyed understanding of how things are now. They are made in part based on an understanding built up over time, some of which reflects how things were when they were when growing up. In particular, parents and other advisers who have a lot of pull can easily be acting on the basis of a decades-old view of the world. So even if things are shifting, current actions could well be lagging behind.