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Stand Alone Complex is actually an amazing social commentary on emergent resistance movements among a group of marginalized people in the era of "fake news" or

Stand Alone Complex is actually an amazing social commentary on emergent resistance movements among a group of marginalized people in the era of "fake news" or "false memories". It was way ahead of its time -- and even more relevant today than it was a decade ago. Trump is basically the galvanizing "cult of personality" figure who was able to connect with a population that was marginalized by both the government and the media -- much like Hideo Kuze was to the refugees. In the case of Trump, he energized the people, but also similar to Kuze, he can't really control every aspect of the emergent behavior (anti-semitism in Trump's case, etc). I would even say that it's similar to the Kuze storyline in that the "cult of personality" figure is actually being manipulated by a foreign power (ironically the American Empire in SAC) for their own ends. Similar comparisons can be made with Al Qaeda, ISIS, Boko Haram, or any other movements that start with legitimate gripes but are manipulated by false information to different ends. It's definitely not a new phenomenon, but SAC was amazingly prophetic about how it would play out in an age of instant communication. It's unfortunate that it's so difficult to approach (you won't really "get it" until your second or third watch through) -- I don't know any other show that had multiple episodes that were essentially philosophical lectures by the main characters / tachikomas .

peterwwillis 9y ago
While Kuze is kind of a launching point, Trump is more like one of the other members of the Individual Eleven. He's a byproduct of a collective group that is already spawning copycats. He's had lateral movement from social power to personal power, and harnesses both, which other copycats simply have failed to do so far. He's a sort of evolved organism. I heard an example of it today in a program by the Guardian, covering the special election in Montana. The reporter interviewed an old (80? 90?) lady, who said this one candidate was clearly ridiculous because he had a TV ad where he shot a television. The reporter then mentioned how the opposing candidate - her candidate - ran an identical ad. She said they were completely different examples. He then said she probably only thought they were different because one of them was for the candidate she wanted, and she agreed. Another example was when the reporter asked her why she supported Trump regardless of his failures or scandals, and she said because he is a real, normal person. The reporter offered that many people find him the opposite of a normal person, and she replied that they don't know what they're talking about. "Gouda notes that there is a tendency within a Stand Alone Complex for the masses to unconsciously project their inadequacies and common desires onto a leader." I think this kind of self-manipulation in order to achieve a specific goal is essentially a form of Stand Alone Complex, in the form of thought patterns being duplicated among a group, with no explicit intention to do so. In order to achieve an unspoken specific social change the people follow an icon, and do anything they need to do to continue following that icon and eventually achieve the goal.
- exelius 9y ago
  I dunno; I do think Trump fits the structure (with someone like Bannon acting as Gouda in this case). Regardless of how you feel about him, he is clearly a very charismatic person -- SAC mentions MLK and Hitler as pre-cyber examples of people around whom a Stand Alone Complex formed, so the motives of the person are less important than their charisma and ability to identify and address the distributed concerns of the population. Trump was obviously able to tap into this collective consciousness / common desires -- a border wall is a stupid fucking idea that basically every expert thinks is a waste of money, but is an example of the masses projecting their inadequacies onto him (and Trump reacting in turn to give them what they want).
justifier 9y ago
you want to call Trump and his supporters a stand alone complex, well maybe But claiming trump as an analogue to kuze is offensive to the efforts of everyone involved in the stand alone complex
- exelius 9y ago
  The stand alone complex existed before Trump. He just tapped into it and galvanized their ideas. And it's clear Gouda didn't work alone either -- he pulled the strings behind the scenes through fake media, but others were obviously working with him offscreen. Bannon fits this well from his time at Breitbart -- he was trying to create a movement, and eventually a charismatic leader emerged and people projected whatever they wanted on that leader.
  - justifier 9y ago
    I'm sorry if it was unclear but the second 'stand alone complex' in my comment was referring to the series itself Meaning to say Trump is analogous to kuze is offensive to the people who developed the show

peterwwillis 9y ago

While Kuze is kind of a launching point, Trump is more like one of the other members of the Individual Eleven. He's a byproduct of a collective group that is already spawning copycats. He's had lateral movement from social power to personal power, and harnesses both, which other copycats simply have failed to do so far. He's a sort of evolved organism. I heard an example of it today in a program by the Guardian, covering the special election in Montana. The reporter interviewed an old (80? 90?) lady, who said this one candidate was clearly ridiculous because he had a TV ad where he shot a television. The reporter then mentioned how the opposing candidate - her candidate - ran an identical ad. She said they were completely different examples. He then said she probably only thought they were different because one of them was for the candidate she wanted, and she agreed. Another example was when the reporter asked her why she supported Trump regardless of his failures or scandals, and she said because he is a real, normal person. The reporter offered that many people find him the opposite of a normal person, and she replied that they don't know what they're talking about. "Gouda notes that there is a tendency within a Stand Alone Complex for the masses to unconsciously project their inadequacies and common desires onto a leader." I think this kind of self-manipulation in order to achieve a specific goal is essentially a form of Stand Alone Complex, in the form of thought patterns being duplicated among a group, with no explicit intention to do so. In order to achieve an unspoken specific social change the people follow an icon, and do anything they need to do to continue following that icon and eventually achieve the goal.

exelius 9y ago
I dunno; I do think Trump fits the structure (with someone like Bannon acting as Gouda in this case). Regardless of how you feel about him, he is clearly a very charismatic person -- SAC mentions MLK and Hitler as pre-cyber examples of people around whom a Stand Alone Complex formed, so the motives of the person are less important than their charisma and ability to identify and address the distributed concerns of the population. Trump was obviously able to tap into this collective consciousness / common desires -- a border wall is a stupid fucking idea that basically every expert thinks is a waste of money, but is an example of the masses projecting their inadequacies onto him (and Trump reacting in turn to give them what they want).

justifier 9y ago

you want to call Trump and his supporters a stand alone complex, well maybe But claiming trump as an analogue to kuze is offensive to the efforts of everyone involved in the stand alone complex

exelius 9y ago
The stand alone complex existed before Trump. He just tapped into it and galvanized their ideas. And it's clear Gouda didn't work alone either -- he pulled the strings behind the scenes through fake media, but others were obviously working with him offscreen. Bannon fits this well from his time at Breitbart -- he was trying to create a movement, and eventually a charismatic leader emerged and people projected whatever they wanted on that leader.
- justifier 9y ago
  I'm sorry if it was unclear but the second 'stand alone complex' in my comment was referring to the series itself Meaning to say Trump is analogous to kuze is offensive to the people who developed the show