5 ms·

Finally, a Moscow Metro Map that deson't look like a Soviet relic

30 points by tomh 16y ago

aw3c2 16y ago
Call me traditionalist but I quite like http://www.wtr.ru/moscow/eng/metro/metro.html http://www.wtr.ru/moscow/eng/metro/metro.html The columns make it much faster to scan over station names. And its got local character while the other just looks like any other western metropolian map. The new one looks tentacly somehow. The "connectors" on the old one are great. Oh, it's just an Artsy Lebedev project...
- asdflkj 16y ago
  A big flaw in that one is that you almost can't tell which name belongs to which station, near the center. This could be fixed as easily as making the names same color as the lines. Dunno why they didn't do that.
lkozma 16y ago
"the studio has an excellent play by play of its design process, which seems rather courageous in a country that doesn't exactly encourage the sharing of information" Now that's a quite broad generalization.
- noahr 16y ago
  That's not a generalization at all. There is a bill before parliament there right now that would give the Federal Security Service broad censorship powers. And independent journalists in the country are being murdered, and the police appear to be uninterested in solving the crimes. From the Committee to Protect Journalists: "18 press killings have gone unsolved since 2000. Two of the journalists killed in 2009 worked for a single newspaper, the independent Novaya Gazeta." http://cpj.org/reports/2010/04/cpj-2010-impunity-index-getting-away-with-murder.php http://cpj.org/reports/2010/04/cpj-2010-impunity-index-getti...
  - asdflkj 16y ago
    In Russia journalists get killed time to time (mostly by overzealous provincial lords); in the USA they never say anything worth killing for to begin with. They wouldn't get killed, but they would get sued and/or marginalized, and that's enough to keep them in line. Is it really freedom if everyone's too afraid to exercise it? Remember that guy on TV who got fired for suggesting that 9/11 highjackers were in fact not cowardly? Russian media, bad as they have it, would laugh at this sort of culture. P.S.: I speak Russian and get to see some of that Russian media in action, unlike most of you who only hear rumors about it from your ideology syndicate of choice. There are probably other Russian-speakers here who know more about it than I do. I'd like to hear what they have to say.
    - noahr 16y ago
      If you think journalists in the U.S. never write anything worth killing for then you're reading the wrong sources. You're also confusing commentary and journalism -- opinion is not the same as uncovering the truth in situations where people are trying to hide it from the public. What's more, you blame "provincial lords" for the killings, but the police and government there are not doing anything to stop them either.
      - vetinari 16y ago
        That's because in this part of world, the "provincial lords" are the police and local government.
      - asdflkj 16y ago
        I'm not gonna write any more about Russia, because it's probably impossible for someone in a society based on large, reliable (if not always good) institutions to understand a society based on a much larger number of smaller, less stable, and less well-integrated institutions, like Russia. On top of that, Russia's smartest and most ambitious people don't have the option of going into some technical field or academia, because that just doesn't provide a comfortable life. So they aim for power, and as a result the game of power is much more complicated than e.g. in America. For anyone interested in Russia, I suggest looking at more basic things, like what life is like for the average Russian. Actually it's probably a good idea for approaching any society--to try to understand culture first, and politics last. I want to ask, though--what are the right sources?
nmk 16y ago
Another recently developed alternative by Ilya Birman: http://ilyabirman.ru/english/moscow-metro/ http://ilyabirman.ru/english/moscow-metro/ And another one by Viacheslav Ilinskov: http://www.artdragon.ru/ http://www.artdragon.ru/ IMO, both are better as far as the aesthetics of the connecting stations is concerned.
cema 16y ago
Another one that does not look like a Soviet relic, or like anything else at all: http://pics.livejournal.com/mi3ch/pic/00324y15 http://pics.livejournal.com/mi3ch/pic/00324y15 (from http://mi3ch.livejournal.com/1038793.html http://mi3ch.livejournal.com/1038793.html [ru]). Not that I would use it as a map, exactly...
- huhtenberg 16y ago
  Wow, really nice. Thought this will require a redesign of a carriage to match :)
Terretta 16y ago
Comparing the proposed map with the current map (the 2nd map in the article), it's clear that the river provides scale and locality, allowing better association with one's mental above ground map. Put back the river, and the proposed one would be better. Without it, a tremendous amount of context is lost.
- fix3r 16y ago
  London's tube map almost lost the river recently, too, but they quickly put it back on the map.
mortenjorck 16y ago
It must be nice, having a metro system where your biggest concerns are the spatial and typographic qualities of the map. There are stations (perhaps entire lines) on the our very own Chicago Transit Authority that look a lot more like a Soviet relic than that old network diagram.
richcollins 16y ago
I'd like to see the "Soviet relics"
iskander 16y ago
The old one is easier for me to read and easier to grok as a map. Is this a case of design aesthetic winning over functionality?

30 points by tomh 16y ago

aw3c2 16y ago

Call me traditionalist but I quite like http://www.wtr.ru/moscow/eng/metro/metro.html http://www.wtr.ru/moscow/eng/metro/metro.html The columns make it much faster to scan over station names. And its got local character while the other just looks like any other western metropolian map. The new one looks tentacly somehow. The "connectors" on the old one are great. Oh, it's just an Artsy Lebedev project...

asdflkj 16y ago
A big flaw in that one is that you almost can't tell which name belongs to which station, near the center. This could be fixed as easily as making the names same color as the lines. Dunno why they didn't do that.

lkozma 16y ago

"the studio has an excellent play by play of its design process, which seems rather courageous in a country that doesn't exactly encourage the sharing of information" Now that's a quite broad generalization.

noahr 16y ago
That's not a generalization at all. There is a bill before parliament there right now that would give the Federal Security Service broad censorship powers. And independent journalists in the country are being murdered, and the police appear to be uninterested in solving the crimes. From the Committee to Protect Journalists: "18 press killings have gone unsolved since 2000. Two of the journalists killed in 2009 worked for a single newspaper, the independent Novaya Gazeta." http://cpj.org/reports/2010/04/cpj-2010-impunity-index-getting-away-with-murder.php http://cpj.org/reports/2010/04/cpj-2010-impunity-index-getti...
- asdflkj 16y ago
  In Russia journalists get killed time to time (mostly by overzealous provincial lords); in the USA they never say anything worth killing for to begin with. They wouldn't get killed, but they would get sued and/or marginalized, and that's enough to keep them in line. Is it really freedom if everyone's too afraid to exercise it? Remember that guy on TV who got fired for suggesting that 9/11 highjackers were in fact not cowardly? Russian media, bad as they have it, would laugh at this sort of culture. P.S.: I speak Russian and get to see some of that Russian media in action, unlike most of you who only hear rumors about it from your ideology syndicate of choice. There are probably other Russian-speakers here who know more about it than I do. I'd like to hear what they have to say.
  - noahr 16y ago
    If you think journalists in the U.S. never write anything worth killing for then you're reading the wrong sources. You're also confusing commentary and journalism -- opinion is not the same as uncovering the truth in situations where people are trying to hide it from the public. What's more, you blame "provincial lords" for the killings, but the police and government there are not doing anything to stop them either.
    - vetinari 16y ago
      That's because in this part of world, the "provincial lords" are the police and local government.
    - asdflkj 16y ago
      I'm not gonna write any more about Russia, because it's probably impossible for someone in a society based on large, reliable (if not always good) institutions to understand a society based on a much larger number of smaller, less stable, and less well-integrated institutions, like Russia. On top of that, Russia's smartest and most ambitious people don't have the option of going into some technical field or academia, because that just doesn't provide a comfortable life. So they aim for power, and as a result the game of power is much more complicated than e.g. in America. For anyone interested in Russia, I suggest looking at more basic things, like what life is like for the average Russian. Actually it's probably a good idea for approaching any society--to try to understand culture first, and politics last. I want to ask, though--what are the right sources?

nmk 16y ago

Another recently developed alternative by Ilya Birman: http://ilyabirman.ru/english/moscow-metro/ http://ilyabirman.ru/english/moscow-metro/ And another one by Viacheslav Ilinskov: http://www.artdragon.ru/ http://www.artdragon.ru/ IMO, both are better as far as the aesthetics of the connecting stations is concerned.

cema 16y ago

Another one that does not look like a Soviet relic, or like anything else at all: http://pics.livejournal.com/mi3ch/pic/00324y15 http://pics.livejournal.com/mi3ch/pic/00324y15 (from http://mi3ch.livejournal.com/1038793.html http://mi3ch.livejournal.com/1038793.html [ru]). Not that I would use it as a map, exactly...

huhtenberg 16y ago
Wow, really nice. Thought this will require a redesign of a carriage to match :)

Terretta 16y ago

Comparing the proposed map with the current map (the 2nd map in the article), it's clear that the river provides scale and locality, allowing better association with one's mental above ground map. Put back the river, and the proposed one would be better. Without it, a tremendous amount of context is lost.

fix3r 16y ago
London's tube map almost lost the river recently, too, but they quickly put it back on the map.

mortenjorck 16y ago

It must be nice, having a metro system where your biggest concerns are the spatial and typographic qualities of the map. There are stations (perhaps entire lines) on the our very own Chicago Transit Authority that look a lot more like a Soviet relic than that old network diagram.

richcollins 16y ago

I'd like to see the "Soviet relics"

iskander 16y ago

The old one is easier for me to read and easier to grok as a map. Is this a case of design aesthetic winning over functionality?