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Yes, it's exciting that a half point win gives us no bound on the strength difference betwen the human player and AlphaGo -- the human player could play "twice
by cjbprime 9y ago
Yes, it's exciting that a half point win gives us no bound on the strength difference betwen the human player and AlphaGo -- the human player could play "twice as well" and still lose by 0.5.
The best way to test strength, assuming Ke Jie continues to lose, would be to start giving handicap stones until the winrate stabilizes. I'd guess that AlphaGo is no more than two stones stronger, but maybe that's just more bias towards humans..
- a13n 9y agoThis! This would give us an idea of "how much stronger?" rather than just answering the question "is it stronger?"
- mattnewton 9y agoIn the match commentary they talk about why no one is likely to take them up on that offer, because losing at a handicap would be devastating for the self confidence of a pro.
- CamperBob2 9y agoI don't understand that. Should an Olympic weightlifter lose confidence if he can't beat a forklift?
- chki 9y agoI think the difference is that Go is played on a psychological level as well, while weightlifting is (mainly) not. Somebody mentioned this in another Go Thread on hn a few days ago: Professionell Go players do not like to play against "weak" players because they are afraid of the psychological damage an (unlikely) loss might have on their play.
- CydeWeys 9y agoYou can imagine the same applying to MMA fighters, too. The outcome is never a sure thing; you can always catch a lucky punch from someone much less skilled than you and lose in the most embarrassing manner possible, by knockout. Hell, look at how Ronda Rousey's self esteem was shattered from a single such loss. Weightlifting isn't the best example because it's a big group competition without the individual 1-on-1 aspect to it, and chance plays less of a role. Yeah, you might feel out of sorts on competition day because you didn't peak in your training properly, lift 20 kg left than you're capable of, and subsequently not place, but it's not supremely embarrassing. You're still a very strong person, which you demonstrated. Rousey, though, just got demolished.
- hypersoar 9y agoThey might if they've been a competitive weightlifter their whole life before forklifts are suddenly invented.
- Florin_Andrei 9y agoI don't think we're yet at the point where AI is equated by our psychology with a forklift or toaster.
- dmd 9y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Henry_(folklore) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Henry_(folklore)
- CardenB 9y agoHumans are considered a dominant species because of their intelligence, not their strength.