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I don't think that first line is true, most adults are able to be disagreeable without using a slur, such as us. So no, I would say sexism wouldn't exist if peo

by cjslep 9y ago

I don't think that first line is true, most adults are able to be disagreeable without using a slur, such as us. So no, I would say sexism wouldn't exist if people could disagree on merits of discussion instead of any insults (which, by nature of personal attack, immediately invokes all *isms of the victim). Second, there's a huge difference between insulting someone because of their perceived character ("asshole") with little cultural baggage, and insulting someone for being literally in their own skin with a word that has huge cultural baggage. On this point I would hope we would agree. Also, I find comparisons of Trump to Hitler silly and overreactionary (and I have a book recommendation for those that want to learn how Hitler actually rose to power). Finally, I do agree that the lashing out against Trump supporters is bad. Just as it was bad that Obama supporters also had to put up with burning crosses in their frontyards when he was elected. Both sides can't see this sucks for everyone at different times for some reason and it's a stupid cycle. The ultimate lack of empathy from both sides is what really bothers me, the culmination of which is the continued ignorance of believing we are in some post-race society. I may as well proclaim we are a species that lives on multiple planets because we sent humans to the Moon once.

anothercomment 9y ago
But people get angry and want to insult each other. Sure, it would be nicer if they wouldn't, but it is not in itself related to racism or sexism. I guess the unwarranted insults are often the most annoying, because there is no possible counter.
deleted 9y ago
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whitemale 9y ago
> most adults are able to be disagreeable without using a slur, such as us The whole point of an insult is to get the other side angry, not necessarily for it to have roots in reality. I do agree that it's not a good way to have an argument. If I want to insult you I'll look at what hurts you the most. Here is something that's not being called out as racist: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5ulvcqaiM8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5ulvcqaiM8 > I would say sexism wouldn't exist if people could disagree on merits of discussion instead of any insults (which, by nature of personal attack, immediately invokes all *isms of the victim). Sexism exists because: - there are a few actually sexist males and females out there see: https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=marissa+mayer+gender+bias&oq=marissa+mayer+gender+bias https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=marissa+mayer+gender+bias&... - biology is sexist and there is little we can do about that - sexism can be used as a great excuse for failing and it can be weaponized, you can threaten your boss that you'll call him sexist if you, the female don't get the promotion instead of the more qualified male What I don't believe exists is: systematic sexism, that I believe is made up to be the ultimate excuse for everything. > there's a huge difference between insulting someone because of their perceived character ("asshole") with little cultural baggage, and insulting someone for being literally in their own skin with a word that has huge cultural baggage There is no difference if your objective is to hurt the other person's feelings, you pick whichever is most effective. > Finally, I do agree that the lashing out against Trump supporters is bad. Just as it was bad that Obama supporters also had to put up with burning crosses in their frontyards when he was elected. Both sides can't see this sucks for everyone at different times for some reason and it's a stupid cycle. I mostly noticed this from Hilary supporters, it's not an eye for an eye thing: http://blog.samaltman.com/what-i-heard-from-trump-supporters http://blog.samaltman.com/what-i-heard-from-trump-supporters > continued ignorance of believing we are in some post-race society Do we have slavery? No Is it acceptable to be openly racist? No What is your criteria for a 'post-race society'? What other checkboxes do we need to hit to get there?
- cjslep 9y ago
  Systematic sexism is tens of thousands of men telling women to "smile more" at work to look prettier, the opposite of which does not happen at a huge scale (but is also wrong). There is a difference between institutional isms (eg slavery, separate-but-equal) and systemic isms (eg private schools in The South, disproportionally higher rates of police brutality of minorities). Is it acceptable to be openly racist? Yes, in certain parts of America. My grandparents' county courthouse had a KKK rally to celebrate census results showing no minorities lived there. This was early 2000s. Also, I'm not going to keep discussing this with you mich further as all your responses are not conveying a genuine desire to discuss and consider arguments you disagree with, which is frankly a waste of both our time.
  - whitemale 9y ago
    > Systematic sexism systematic Done or acting according to a fixed plan or system; methodical. Source: https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/systematic https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/systematic If this is systematic, then I guess you can tell me who is in charge of this plan or system? What is the goal of this plan or system and who does it benefit and how? > thousands of men telling women to "smile more" at work to look prettier Is this the biggest issue in women's lives today? If these are the biggest problems we have, I would say we are in a really great place. Also, what about women telling women the same thing? > Is it acceptable to be openly racist? Yes, in certain parts of America. My grandparents' county courthouse had a KKK rally to celebrate census results showing no minorities lived there. This was early 2000s. Do reports on it. Call them out and protest there instead of places where there is hardly any racism. Call out specific regions and people, don't just say that, well everybody's racist, because this will not get people on your side. > Also, I'm not going to keep discussing this with you mich further So these were your best arguments? > as all your responses are not conveying a genuine desire to discuss and consider arguments you disagree with, which is frankly a waste of both our time. I have no idea where you got that idea from, I was just raising genuine questions and counter points that most people with the same opinion as you are having trouble answering. You can't expect me to accept the existence of things like "Systematic sexism" if you can't define what it is, and prove it. If your views are on solid ground, you should have no trouble defending them.

by cjslep 9y ago

anothercomment 9y ago

But people get angry and want to insult each other. Sure, it would be nicer if they wouldn't, but it is not in itself related to racism or sexism. I guess the unwarranted insults are often the most annoying, because there is no possible counter.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

whitemale 9y ago

> most adults are able to be disagreeable without using a slur, such as us The whole point of an insult is to get the other side angry, not necessarily for it to have roots in reality. I do agree that it's not a good way to have an argument. If I want to insult you I'll look at what hurts you the most. Here is something that's not being called out as racist: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5ulvcqaiM8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5ulvcqaiM8 > I would say sexism wouldn't exist if people could disagree on merits of discussion instead of any insults (which, by nature of personal attack, immediately invokes all *isms of the victim). Sexism exists because: - there are a few actually sexist males and females out there see: https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=marissa+mayer+gender+bias&oq=marissa+mayer+gender+bias https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=marissa+mayer+gender+bias&... - biology is sexist and there is little we can do about that - sexism can be used as a great excuse for failing and it can be weaponized, you can threaten your boss that you'll call him sexist if you, the female don't get the promotion instead of the more qualified male What I don't believe exists is: systematic sexism, that I believe is made up to be the ultimate excuse for everything. > there's a huge difference between insulting someone because of their perceived character ("asshole") with little cultural baggage, and insulting someone for being literally in their own skin with a word that has huge cultural baggage There is no difference if your objective is to hurt the other person's feelings, you pick whichever is most effective. > Finally, I do agree that the lashing out against Trump supporters is bad. Just as it was bad that Obama supporters also had to put up with burning crosses in their frontyards when he was elected. Both sides can't see this sucks for everyone at different times for some reason and it's a stupid cycle. I mostly noticed this from Hilary supporters, it's not an eye for an eye thing: http://blog.samaltman.com/what-i-heard-from-trump-supporters http://blog.samaltman.com/what-i-heard-from-trump-supporters > continued ignorance of believing we are in some post-race society Do we have slavery? No Is it acceptable to be openly racist? No What is your criteria for a 'post-race society'? What other checkboxes do we need to hit to get there?

cjslep 9y ago
Systematic sexism is tens of thousands of men telling women to "smile more" at work to look prettier, the opposite of which does not happen at a huge scale (but is also wrong). There is a difference between institutional isms (eg slavery, separate-but-equal) and systemic isms (eg private schools in The South, disproportionally higher rates of police brutality of minorities). Is it acceptable to be openly racist? Yes, in certain parts of America. My grandparents' county courthouse had a KKK rally to celebrate census results showing no minorities lived there. This was early 2000s. Also, I'm not going to keep discussing this with you mich further as all your responses are not conveying a genuine desire to discuss and consider arguments you disagree with, which is frankly a waste of both our time.
- whitemale 9y ago
  > Systematic sexism systematic Done or acting according to a fixed plan or system; methodical. Source: https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/systematic https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/systematic If this is systematic, then I guess you can tell me who is in charge of this plan or system? What is the goal of this plan or system and who does it benefit and how? > thousands of men telling women to "smile more" at work to look prettier Is this the biggest issue in women's lives today? If these are the biggest problems we have, I would say we are in a really great place. Also, what about women telling women the same thing? > Is it acceptable to be openly racist? Yes, in certain parts of America. My grandparents' county courthouse had a KKK rally to celebrate census results showing no minorities lived there. This was early 2000s. Do reports on it. Call them out and protest there instead of places where there is hardly any racism. Call out specific regions and people, don't just say that, well everybody's racist, because this will not get people on your side. > Also, I'm not going to keep discussing this with you mich further So these were your best arguments? > as all your responses are not conveying a genuine desire to discuss and consider arguments you disagree with, which is frankly a waste of both our time. I have no idea where you got that idea from, I was just raising genuine questions and counter points that most people with the same opinion as you are having trouble answering. You can't expect me to accept the existence of things like "Systematic sexism" if you can't define what it is, and prove it. If your views are on solid ground, you should have no trouble defending them.