7 ms·

Bullshit. We are built by evolution to live in this particular physical environment and had no trouble living there for last few millions of years or so. What

by lngnmn 9y ago

Bullshit. We are built by evolution to live in this particular physical environment and had no trouble living there for last few millions of years or so. What we are not evolved to do is to live in an overpopulated urban areas, forced to wage slavery and to constantly compete for everything, even a place in a subway, while being awashed with emotionally charged verbal and visual bullshit 24h, hipsterism and other forms of idiotic cosplay of unearned success and presumably high social status by each and every one passed by, while being over-regulated by stupid laws imposed on us by a bloated self-serving "government" so even a straight look of contempt at a tasteless, fat woman in some stupid yoga pants would lead to trouble. the Moment has nothing to do with this. It is so called "human society".

ghthor 9y ago
I'm perfectly happy living in one of those urban areas. I speak out when the people around me are doing things that are rude or dangerous or disgusting and then I move on. My actions towards others are intended to avoid causing all the problems you're describing(anxiety, self-doubt, nervousness); hopefully they inspire others to be considerate or change their behavior. The mindfulness skills that cities help cultivate are acceptance and releasing(letting go). If you find yourself constantly angry or stressed or nervous about other people you should probably remove yourself from the situation, relax and let it go. If you aren't prepared for confrontation or are worried about the situation escalating then use the moments before you let it go to come up with other ways to potentially solve the problem. Get crazy with it, like making a bunch of untraceable fliers, or making a long anonymous post to some digital community related to the location or activity. Their are lots of ways to influence how people act in the long term, in the short term direct confrontation almost always works. Situations where you're unable to remove yourself from the area to avoid someone are the worst. This is why performances on the subway piss me off so much, or people ranting about something. I've been making a point to directly confront anyone doing anything that makes me uncomfortable on the subway and tell them why it makes me uncomfortable and that they need to stop. Just today some women came on the train and started yelling about eating a plant based diet, how it was good for the planet. I agree with her and I'm on and off vegan, but it's NOT fucking cool to start yelling on the subway unless you're getting violated by someone or you're in danger. I snapped her with my spectacles repeating, "ma'am, would you stop yelling on the train", ending with, "You're making all vegans look bad." She did finally stop
- crush-n-spread 9y ago
  I think the point is not that humans can learn to cope with urban environments, like you suggest - The point is that humans weren't meant to live in them. Everything the parent poster says is true, and you're just saying "Humans can get to a point where it's tolerable." I for one think I should not have a verbal and visual barrage of bullshit hit me with full force everyday, powered by the interests of multinational tech companies or governments. Peace and quiet is something that should be treasured, not lost and then made up for with mental tricks.
  - workerIbe 9y ago
    Funny, at any moment I might agree with each of you. One moment (actually a few days) I will dream of a simpler time or maybe some post apocalyptic future another I am soaking in the barrage quite amused by it and the puzzle of it's purpose and yet another influencing and enjoying those around me. I have no plan ( more than a few days), I live in the moment.
  - Banthum 9y ago
    You could consider going to live in a rural area and getting a simpler job. It's a real option and many people choose it.
    - crush-n-spread 9y ago
      I appreciate the suggestion. I am 22 and happened to grow up in a very small town of ~400 people without internet until I was 16. I moved to the city to get software work and I will stay here for the rest of my life. So I guess I'm a hypocrite.
  - ghthor 9y ago
    I agree. My long term plan with my life is to acquire the wealth and knowledge to build and maintain my own life using permaculture. I'd say I agree with you and the thread OP that we weren't made to live in these nasty, dirty, stressing urban environments. My main point is that the knowledge in this article arms you with the idea that you can cope and live within these non-humane environments by basically hacking your brain(avoiding negative prediction paths). You could call it raising your awareness to a higher level of consciousness. So, while you still might notice from time to time someone is doing something gross or that would annoy you, you no longer focus on it. You let it go, you focus on something else, your breathe, your balance, what you making for dinner, how much you love someone, how bad our infrastructure is, how to solve that problem at work, how not to solve that problem at work, how did that nasty ass smear get on the subway door's window?
ucontrol 9y ago
In my opinion, many people make this mistake by believing that just because we've evolved to live a certain lifestyle (the example being pre-civilization hunter-gatherer societies) - that this way of life is indisputably the most comfortable and natural way for us to live, and that deviating from this lifestyle in any way is almost always detrimental. In other words, they fail to take into consideration that reduction of challenge (e.g. through technological means) is also change in everyday behavior that deviates from the "orthodox" way of living, but nevertheless it makes life much better. We don't live how our bodies intended to live, and prehistoric behaviors are no longer practiced - but the fact that there is no need anymore to exercise this sort of behavior is a good thing, since the necessity to do so implied struggle, discomfort and scarcity - all unfavorable circumstance. In short - living as nature intended implied struggle, and the cessation of that way of life is in many ways a result of removal of struggle, and not necessarily just some "unorthodox" living that allegedly puts our being under unnaturally high amounts stress. My point: Yes, the contemporary lifestyle is stressful, and yes it is very different from the way we've evolved to live, but it's probably still much more comfortable and enjoyable than any aboriginal circumstance and prehistoric way of life our ancestors found themselves in.
- ghthor 9y ago
  I'd argue that some of our ancestors lived in quite egalitarian groups of abundance even without the technology we have today; And conversely our world today is drive by inequality and scarcity despite our amazing technology. What technology has really given us is security. The paradise of our ancestors could have been ruined by disease or famine caused by the climate changing or and unexpected flood. Or just a new group of predators moving into the region making it dangerous or killing off the prime game food for the tribe. Our technology and knowledge provides us security and foresight so we're able to move or stockpile or even invent new technology to avoid catastrophes. Sadly, here we are faced with the total disruption of our biosphere and we're having trouble not fucking it up. One, I believe people feel this way about our ancestors because of the feelings one experiences when they really visit and listen to nature. I for one can almost solve any emotional problems with a good walk in the woods. This feeling drives our awareness of the discomfort that our civilization shoves down our throat everyday. We've used technology to simplify our lives and complicate our lives. Right now I think we've complicated our individual lives quite a lot, but with that complication comes a security that someone else did enough work that I can get something eat tomorrow.

by lngnmn 9y ago

ghthor 9y ago

I'm perfectly happy living in one of those urban areas. I speak out when the people around me are doing things that are rude or dangerous or disgusting and then I move on. My actions towards others are intended to avoid causing all the problems you're describing(anxiety, self-doubt, nervousness); hopefully they inspire others to be considerate or change their behavior. The mindfulness skills that cities help cultivate are acceptance and releasing(letting go). If you find yourself constantly angry or stressed or nervous about other people you should probably remove yourself from the situation, relax and let it go. If you aren't prepared for confrontation or are worried about the situation escalating then use the moments before you let it go to come up with other ways to potentially solve the problem. Get crazy with it, like making a bunch of untraceable fliers, or making a long anonymous post to some digital community related to the location or activity. Their are lots of ways to influence how people act in the long term, in the short term direct confrontation almost always works. Situations where you're unable to remove yourself from the area to avoid someone are the worst. This is why performances on the subway piss me off so much, or people ranting about something. I've been making a point to directly confront anyone doing anything that makes me uncomfortable on the subway and tell them why it makes me uncomfortable and that they need to stop. Just today some women came on the train and started yelling about eating a plant based diet, how it was good for the planet. I agree with her and I'm on and off vegan, but it's NOT fucking cool to start yelling on the subway unless you're getting violated by someone or you're in danger. I snapped her with my spectacles repeating, "ma'am, would you stop yelling on the train", ending with, "You're making all vegans look bad." She did finally stop

crush-n-spread 9y ago
I think the point is not that humans can learn to cope with urban environments, like you suggest - The point is that humans weren't meant to live in them. Everything the parent poster says is true, and you're just saying "Humans can get to a point where it's tolerable." I for one think I should not have a verbal and visual barrage of bullshit hit me with full force everyday, powered by the interests of multinational tech companies or governments. Peace and quiet is something that should be treasured, not lost and then made up for with mental tricks.
- workerIbe 9y ago
  Funny, at any moment I might agree with each of you. One moment (actually a few days) I will dream of a simpler time or maybe some post apocalyptic future another I am soaking in the barrage quite amused by it and the puzzle of it's purpose and yet another influencing and enjoying those around me. I have no plan ( more than a few days), I live in the moment.
- Banthum 9y ago
  You could consider going to live in a rural area and getting a simpler job. It's a real option and many people choose it.
  - crush-n-spread 9y ago
    I appreciate the suggestion. I am 22 and happened to grow up in a very small town of ~400 people without internet until I was 16. I moved to the city to get software work and I will stay here for the rest of my life. So I guess I'm a hypocrite.
- ghthor 9y ago
  I agree. My long term plan with my life is to acquire the wealth and knowledge to build and maintain my own life using permaculture. I'd say I agree with you and the thread OP that we weren't made to live in these nasty, dirty, stressing urban environments. My main point is that the knowledge in this article arms you with the idea that you can cope and live within these non-humane environments by basically hacking your brain(avoiding negative prediction paths). You could call it raising your awareness to a higher level of consciousness. So, while you still might notice from time to time someone is doing something gross or that would annoy you, you no longer focus on it. You let it go, you focus on something else, your breathe, your balance, what you making for dinner, how much you love someone, how bad our infrastructure is, how to solve that problem at work, how not to solve that problem at work, how did that nasty ass smear get on the subway door's window?

ucontrol 9y ago

In my opinion, many people make this mistake by believing that just because we've evolved to live a certain lifestyle (the example being pre-civilization hunter-gatherer societies) - that this way of life is indisputably the most comfortable and natural way for us to live, and that deviating from this lifestyle in any way is almost always detrimental. In other words, they fail to take into consideration that reduction of challenge (e.g. through technological means) is also change in everyday behavior that deviates from the "orthodox" way of living, but nevertheless it makes life much better. We don't live how our bodies intended to live, and prehistoric behaviors are no longer practiced - but the fact that there is no need anymore to exercise this sort of behavior is a good thing, since the necessity to do so implied struggle, discomfort and scarcity - all unfavorable circumstance. In short - living as nature intended implied struggle, and the cessation of that way of life is in many ways a result of removal of struggle, and not necessarily just some "unorthodox" living that allegedly puts our being under unnaturally high amounts stress. My point: Yes, the contemporary lifestyle is stressful, and yes it is very different from the way we've evolved to live, but it's probably still much more comfortable and enjoyable than any aboriginal circumstance and prehistoric way of life our ancestors found themselves in.

ghthor 9y ago
I'd argue that some of our ancestors lived in quite egalitarian groups of abundance even without the technology we have today; And conversely our world today is drive by inequality and scarcity despite our amazing technology. What technology has really given us is security. The paradise of our ancestors could have been ruined by disease or famine caused by the climate changing or and unexpected flood. Or just a new group of predators moving into the region making it dangerous or killing off the prime game food for the tribe. Our technology and knowledge provides us security and foresight so we're able to move or stockpile or even invent new technology to avoid catastrophes. Sadly, here we are faced with the total disruption of our biosphere and we're having trouble not fucking it up. One, I believe people feel this way about our ancestors because of the feelings one experiences when they really visit and listen to nature. I for one can almost solve any emotional problems with a good walk in the woods. This feeling drives our awareness of the discomfort that our civilization shoves down our throat everyday. We've used technology to simplify our lives and complicate our lives. Right now I think we've complicated our individual lives quite a lot, but with that complication comes a security that someone else did enough work that I can get something eat tomorrow.