4 ms·

I suppose the ball is now in the US' court . Assange is a strange case, hes (Wikileaks is) really a journalist, and should be protected by laws and conventions

I suppose the ball is now in the US' court . Assange is a strange case, hes (Wikileaks is) really a journalist, and should be protected by laws and conventions protecting journalists. But he doesn't seem to identify too strongly with the press and presents more like a political dissident. I used to live in Melbourne (where wikileaks is sort of based). I stopped to sign a petition in his support. The petition mentioned Assange at the top of a long list of dissident left issues: release off-shore asylum seekers, withdraw from afgahnistan, free palestine, jail Blaire & Bush, stop Tasmanian timber harvests, overturn some ruling on Aboriginal land title... They were also inviting people to a dissident-socialist gathering later on that day. Now, I don't want to misrepresent the situatoin. This wasn't Wikileaks petitioning. It was a local activist group promoting their agendas, headlined by the Assange cause. That said, I do think it's kind of indicative of how present themselves & why the Assange debate is associated with the Manning or Snowden cases. They were US operatives "gone rogue." He wasn't. He was just a journalist receiving and diseminating leaked information. I in now way suggesting the protections of a free press system are mooted because he doesn't act or present recognizably as a journalist. But I do think that statements like the CIA Director's (Wikileaks is a hostile non-state actor) would be a lot harder to say if he presented as " Senior Editor of The Wikileaks Times."

kevingadd 9y ago
It's really regrettable that he's swung hard into manipulative conspiracy theories and attacks on people he disagrees with or politicians he dislikes. It's much harder to defend his current conduct as journalism, and WL's conduct with more recent leaks and hacked documents (like Macron's campaign) leaves a lot to be desired. In the past, I think you could make a strong argument that he should've been protected as a pseudo-journalist. I think if he had kept a level head and a more serious approach to these things it would at least be easier to defend him...
- dalbasal 9y ago
  I don't think he swung. He and Wikileaks were politically fringe people all along, and they were rude and confrontational all along. All of that may make you dislike him/them, but it doesn't make him a criminal or an enemy (as the CIA director labels him).
  - pvg 9y ago
    I don't think anyone anywhere has seriously claimed he's a criminal because he was rude.
    - abritinthebay 9y ago
      Plus, most don't even say that: just that he's a dangerous propagandist. Which is pretty undeniable at this point. It's a shame, because the idea of WikiLeaks is decent... but it requires someone with no agenda to skew it. Assange isn't that guy.
- snomad 9y ago
  Given that he was trapped in the same narrow space for 5+ years, he legitimately saw the US exercise unusual power (re-open investigation, pressure on Visa, Mastercard, and Paypal, etc) it is understandable that Wikileaks evolved as it did.
mcv 9y ago
When he still was just a journalist receiving and disseminating leaked information, I supported him. But after the Manning leaks, his power seems to have gone to his head, and he thought he could get away with anything. Journalists need to be protected from persecution for their work as journalism, but they don't get a free license to violate laws in completely unrelated cases. Rape is still rape. And his recent grandstanding trying to manipulate elections through mostly bluff, is really disgusting. I'm done with him. He doesn't stand for anything I support anymore.
- dalbasal 9y ago
  I don't feel as strongly as you do about the man himself, but he isn't my political cup of tea either. But, I think his persecution relates entirely to his work as a journalist IMO, regardless of how he sees it himself. For that reason I support his freedom, even if I don't really care too much about his cause. The free press is important to me.
- empath75 9y ago
  Actually, I think it wasn't the manning papers, it was being locked up in the Ecuadorian embassy, where the Russians were free to compromise him.
  - mcv 9y ago
    That happened later. He was already becoming somewhat unhinged well before that. Though living for years locked in an embassy probably hasn't done him much good either.
seppin 9y ago
> hes (Wikileaks is) really a journalist He (they) were at some point. Ask anyone that once worked with or volunteered for them back around 2010. They have long since become a wing of Russian intelligence and Assange's personal ego play. Sad really.

kevingadd 9y ago

It's really regrettable that he's swung hard into manipulative conspiracy theories and attacks on people he disagrees with or politicians he dislikes. It's much harder to defend his current conduct as journalism, and WL's conduct with more recent leaks and hacked documents (like Macron's campaign) leaves a lot to be desired. In the past, I think you could make a strong argument that he should've been protected as a pseudo-journalist. I think if he had kept a level head and a more serious approach to these things it would at least be easier to defend him...

dalbasal 9y ago
I don't think he swung. He and Wikileaks were politically fringe people all along, and they were rude and confrontational all along. All of that may make you dislike him/them, but it doesn't make him a criminal or an enemy (as the CIA director labels him).
- pvg 9y ago
  I don't think anyone anywhere has seriously claimed he's a criminal because he was rude.
  - abritinthebay 9y ago
    Plus, most don't even say that: just that he's a dangerous propagandist. Which is pretty undeniable at this point. It's a shame, because the idea of WikiLeaks is decent... but it requires someone with no agenda to skew it. Assange isn't that guy.
snomad 9y ago
Given that he was trapped in the same narrow space for 5+ years, he legitimately saw the US exercise unusual power (re-open investigation, pressure on Visa, Mastercard, and Paypal, etc) it is understandable that Wikileaks evolved as it did.

mcv 9y ago

When he still was just a journalist receiving and disseminating leaked information, I supported him. But after the Manning leaks, his power seems to have gone to his head, and he thought he could get away with anything. Journalists need to be protected from persecution for their work as journalism, but they don't get a free license to violate laws in completely unrelated cases. Rape is still rape. And his recent grandstanding trying to manipulate elections through mostly bluff, is really disgusting. I'm done with him. He doesn't stand for anything I support anymore.

dalbasal 9y ago
I don't feel as strongly as you do about the man himself, but he isn't my political cup of tea either. But, I think his persecution relates entirely to his work as a journalist IMO, regardless of how he sees it himself. For that reason I support his freedom, even if I don't really care too much about his cause. The free press is important to me.
empath75 9y ago
Actually, I think it wasn't the manning papers, it was being locked up in the Ecuadorian embassy, where the Russians were free to compromise him.
- mcv 9y ago
  That happened later. He was already becoming somewhat unhinged well before that. Though living for years locked in an embassy probably hasn't done him much good either.

seppin 9y ago

> hes (Wikileaks is) really a journalist He (they) were at some point. Ask anyone that once worked with or volunteered for them back around 2010. They have long since become a wing of Russian intelligence and Assange's personal ego play. Sad really.