4 ms·

Hopefully, adding "Australia is rapidly becoming an international laughingstock" to the list of reasons to drop this stupid law will convince Conroy. I doubt it

by pmccool 16y ago

Hopefully, adding "Australia is rapidly becoming an international laughingstock" to the list of reasons to drop this stupid law will convince Conroy. I doubt it, though; "it won't work", "most people oppose it" and "it's on shaky legal ground" don't seem to have convinced him.

mattmanser 16y ago
This was inevitable, this isn't going to be the aberration, this will be the norm. There will be no laughing, there will be other governments thinking 'why aren't we doing that'. There will be the Daily Mails declaring a breakdown in law because of our failure to legislate. (The Daily Mail being the popular conservative newspaper in the UK, substitute with your regional equivalent). Censorship to TV, to Movies, to CDs, to all forms of media has long happened because most societies, irrespective of our personal beliefs as hackers, libertarians, free thinkers, believe there are lines that should not be crossed. To lambast the list itself is purely pedantic, to despairingly declare 'why a dental surgery?' without speculating that it had probably been hacked and was hosting something distasteful is pathetic. We know exactly how vulnerable the web is, we know how many sites get hacked like that all the time. How easy it is to hide stuff. Did we all seriously believe the wild west of the web would continue as it has? My honest assessment is that we have been living in a censor less utopia only because the web was initially too small and minor and too hard to understand for legislature. Everything was moving too fast. The microscope is finally turning to it and the Iceland's will be the minority, not the majority. And ultimately, for purely tax receipts and business reasons, those lines that can't be crossed will include copyright violations. I mean look at the quote in the piece "Nobody likes it," says Scott Ludlam, a senator from the Australian Greens Party. The Green Party? That's the best they could come up with? If you are being truly objective, that's almost as bad as quoting the BNP saying that no-one likes immigration or the KKK saying no-one likes blacks. Yes, I'm exaggerating, but Greens are pretty far on the left-wing of politics.
- dmharrison 16y ago
  Australia's heading to an election later this year and with the series of missteps by the Rudd/Labor camp (mining tax, education revolution, dodgy insulation implementation) it's likely that the greens will hold the balance of power in the senate, so if the greens don't like it, there's a fair chance it won't make it into legislation. I'd say the Australian greens are closer to the democratic party in the US or the liberal democrats in the UK. So I'd put them center left on average.
  - nl 16y ago
    I'd say the Australian greens are closer to the democratic party in the US or the liberal democrats in the UK. So I'd put them center left on average. Um, no. The Australian Labor party would be on the center-left wing of the US Democratic party. Even the strong right wing faction of the Australian Labor party is well to the left of the "Blue Dog" Democrats (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Dog_Coalition http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Dog_Coalition). For example, one member of the right wing faction of the Labor party is the federal health minister (Nicola Roxon - see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labor_Right#In_Victoria http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labor_Right#In_Victoria), and her biggest policy is a take over of state-run health systems by the federal government. No blue dogger would support that, and I doubt it would get majority support within the US Democratic party. Both Kevin Rudd and Wayne Swan are right faction members (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labor_Right#In_Queensland http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labor_Right#In_Queensland), and they came up with the mining tax! That isn't exactly a centralist policy (by US standards anyway)! The Greens are well to the left of Australian Labor on both social and economic issues. I suspect they are close to the UK Liberal Democrats on social issues, but to the left of them on economic issues.
    - dmharrison 16y ago
      I guess what I was trying to point out is that they're not the crazy greens social enviro anarchist party that you'd tend to think of if you heard of the 'greens' for the first time (generally). They're 'closer' but I agree I wouldn't consider them equivalent or overlapping on an absolute scale. The US center being quite different from the Aus center of course, but normalising across countries is bound to result in a loss of direction. I do wonder if voting wasn't so constrained to party lines what we'd end up with though.
- jstevens85 16y ago
  Actually, several Conservative MPs and at least one Government MP have spoken out against the Internet filter. I don't know why they chose to go with a Greens Senator.
- pmccool 16y ago
  There has been Internet censorship in Australia for some time. What is at issue here is mandatory filtering. The current regime is summarized here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_Australia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_Australi...

by pmccool 16y ago

mattmanser 16y ago

This was inevitable, this isn't going to be the aberration, this will be the norm. There will be no laughing, there will be other governments thinking 'why aren't we doing that'. There will be the Daily Mails declaring a breakdown in law because of our failure to legislate. (The Daily Mail being the popular conservative newspaper in the UK, substitute with your regional equivalent). Censorship to TV, to Movies, to CDs, to all forms of media has long happened because most societies, irrespective of our personal beliefs as hackers, libertarians, free thinkers, believe there are lines that should not be crossed. To lambast the list itself is purely pedantic, to despairingly declare 'why a dental surgery?' without speculating that it had probably been hacked and was hosting something distasteful is pathetic. We know exactly how vulnerable the web is, we know how many sites get hacked like that all the time. How easy it is to hide stuff. Did we all seriously believe the wild west of the web would continue as it has? My honest assessment is that we have been living in a censor less utopia only because the web was initially too small and minor and too hard to understand for legislature. Everything was moving too fast. The microscope is finally turning to it and the Iceland's will be the minority, not the majority. And ultimately, for purely tax receipts and business reasons, those lines that can't be crossed will include copyright violations. I mean look at the quote in the piece "Nobody likes it," says Scott Ludlam, a senator from the Australian Greens Party. The Green Party? That's the best they could come up with? If you are being truly objective, that's almost as bad as quoting the BNP saying that no-one likes immigration or the KKK saying no-one likes blacks. Yes, I'm exaggerating, but Greens are pretty far on the left-wing of politics.

dmharrison 16y ago
Australia's heading to an election later this year and with the series of missteps by the Rudd/Labor camp (mining tax, education revolution, dodgy insulation implementation) it's likely that the greens will hold the balance of power in the senate, so if the greens don't like it, there's a fair chance it won't make it into legislation. I'd say the Australian greens are closer to the democratic party in the US or the liberal democrats in the UK. So I'd put them center left on average.
- nl 16y ago
  I'd say the Australian greens are closer to the democratic party in the US or the liberal democrats in the UK. So I'd put them center left on average. Um, no. The Australian Labor party would be on the center-left wing of the US Democratic party. Even the strong right wing faction of the Australian Labor party is well to the left of the "Blue Dog" Democrats (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Dog_Coalition http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Dog_Coalition). For example, one member of the right wing faction of the Labor party is the federal health minister (Nicola Roxon - see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labor_Right#In_Victoria http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labor_Right#In_Victoria), and her biggest policy is a take over of state-run health systems by the federal government. No blue dogger would support that, and I doubt it would get majority support within the US Democratic party. Both Kevin Rudd and Wayne Swan are right faction members (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labor_Right#In_Queensland http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labor_Right#In_Queensland), and they came up with the mining tax! That isn't exactly a centralist policy (by US standards anyway)! The Greens are well to the left of Australian Labor on both social and economic issues. I suspect they are close to the UK Liberal Democrats on social issues, but to the left of them on economic issues.
  - dmharrison 16y ago
    I guess what I was trying to point out is that they're not the crazy greens social enviro anarchist party that you'd tend to think of if you heard of the 'greens' for the first time (generally). They're 'closer' but I agree I wouldn't consider them equivalent or overlapping on an absolute scale. The US center being quite different from the Aus center of course, but normalising across countries is bound to result in a loss of direction. I do wonder if voting wasn't so constrained to party lines what we'd end up with though.
jstevens85 16y ago
Actually, several Conservative MPs and at least one Government MP have spoken out against the Internet filter. I don't know why they chose to go with a Greens Senator.
pmccool 16y ago
There has been Internet censorship in Australia for some time. What is at issue here is mandatory filtering. The current regime is summarized here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_Australia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_Australi...