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I think they are doing it right. Just find a niche and work at it progressively through life. No need to raise $100M D Rounds, no need to have an explosive exi

I think they are doing it right. Just find a niche and work at it progressively through life. No need to raise $100M D Rounds, no need to have an explosive exit, whatever. I think it would be nice to just steadily have six figures, work on something I love and live life (a la Basecamp). Most of all: Have complete control of your destiny. No investors, no bosses, etc.

coldtea 9y ago
>Most of all: Have complete control of your destiny. No investors, no bosses, etc. Here's a useful guideline to add to what you said: unless some person makes way more than the Basecamp founders (e.g. through some unicorn deal or whatever) and enjoys the same freedom to shape their product, then they have absolutely no leg to stand on to criticize their model much less to sneer. I mean, some startup multi-millionaire/billionaire sneering at "lifestyle businesses" I can understand (though not agree with). But some ramen eating wannabe sneering at them, it's inane, since the majority don't end up nowhere near as succesful.
- draw_down 9y ago
  Ugh, I know! I hate it when broke people have opinions.
  - coldtea 9y ago
    Obviously my comment was not about not liking broke people having opinions. It was about not liking broke "wannabe startup billionaires" sneering on people with lifestyle businesses as if they somehow "failed".
    - Mz 9y ago
      Nonetheless, you are understanding of the sneering of the folks who are rich enough. Sneering is a bad habit no matter your income level. Justifying it for the rich while dismissing it for people who are broke remains an expression of classism, no matter how much you try to clarify your intent.
      - traek 9y ago
        S/he wasn't justifying sneering for the rich, they were saying they understood sneering at lifestyle businesses in the case of people who succeeded at building unicorn startups. It's not about money or class, it's about success in a particular field and judgement of that particular field.
        Mz 9y ago
        Sure. That's why they specified ...some startup multi-millionaire/billionaire ... Because money is not relevant to their point. /s Also, I hate the term "lifestyle business" because: http://micheleincalifornia.blogspot.com/2014/03/i-love-lucy-lifestyle-business-that.html http://micheleincalifornia.blogspot.com/2014/03/i-love-lucy-...
        coldtea 9y ago
        >Sure. That's why they specified ...some startup multi-millionaire/billionaire ... Because money is not relevant to their point. Yes, "sure". My argument was clear enough, and as the parent wrote "it's not about money or class, it's about success in a particular field and judgement of that particular field". What part of either seems difficult to parse? Obviously money is relevant to my point in so much as it serves as the proof of that startup/unicorn success. The idea, and it's bizarro that I have to state it again, is rather that if you're to sneer at somebody for not "making it big" with their business, it only makes sense if you do it while yourself having a bigger business. That's why I wrote millionaire/billionaire, not because I hold millionaires/billionaires in high esteem, or find it OK for them to look down on people. I just find it more logical for a more succesful in business person to sneer at a less succesful in business regarding the latters business success, than the opposite.
        Mz 9y ago
        Money is not the only measure of success. Yet it seems to far too often be the only one cited, whether on HN or elsewhere in the world. Your inability to see that your point is about money and classism while using net worth as THE measure of success worth noting is both frustrating and all too common.
colmvp 9y ago
I know hindsight is 20/20, but it's interesting to me that they could've created Airbnb, as they had both the reach and finances to potentially create a side-project that was specific to short-term rentals. They already had sublets and temporary rentals as a sub-listing since forever. I know that Airbnb comes across as warm and fuzzy hosts who engage with guests, but it's progressively more commercialized with a good portion of hosts either managing multiple short-term rental properties or dedicating a space specifically for the purposes of consistently having short-term rentals.
- MR4D 9y ago
  If I had to bet which would last longer between Craigslist and AirBnB, I would pick Craigslist. I may be wrong, but I think it's the better bet for the long term.
- smelendez 9y ago
  That would have completely changed the company, though. Airbnb works by introducing ratings, insurance and being an intermediary someone can at least theoretically call if a renter is crazy or the listing isn't as advertised. Craigslist has 50 employees and minimal vetting of anything. It's great for what it is, but I would never use it to rent anything site unseen.
  - cgriswald 9y ago
    > Craigslist has 50 employees and minimal vetting of anything. It's great for what it is, but I would never use it to rent anything site unseen. This is one reality show I would watch. Forget all those "We sleep in a dark place recording all the sounds buildings make and then speculate wildly about causes" shows. Sleeping overnight in a house/room/whatever rented randomly off Craigslist would be way more interesting and probably frequently more frightening.
    - jayjay71 9y ago
      I hope someone reads this and makes it a reality.
sreitshamer 9y ago
Niche FTW definitely. But I think it'd be hard to find something that's "steady". I run my own business and it's always changing -- the market's changing, the technologies are changing.

coldtea 9y ago

>Most of all: Have complete control of your destiny. No investors, no bosses, etc. Here's a useful guideline to add to what you said: unless some person makes way more than the Basecamp founders (e.g. through some unicorn deal or whatever) and enjoys the same freedom to shape their product, then they have absolutely no leg to stand on to criticize their model much less to sneer. I mean, some startup multi-millionaire/billionaire sneering at "lifestyle businesses" I can understand (though not agree with). But some ramen eating wannabe sneering at them, it's inane, since the majority don't end up nowhere near as succesful.

draw_down 9y ago
Ugh, I know! I hate it when broke people have opinions.
- coldtea 9y ago
  Obviously my comment was not about not liking broke people having opinions. It was about not liking broke "wannabe startup billionaires" sneering on people with lifestyle businesses as if they somehow "failed".
  - Mz 9y ago
    Nonetheless, you are understanding of the sneering of the folks who are rich enough. Sneering is a bad habit no matter your income level. Justifying it for the rich while dismissing it for people who are broke remains an expression of classism, no matter how much you try to clarify your intent.
    - traek 9y ago
      S/he wasn't justifying sneering for the rich, they were saying they understood sneering at lifestyle businesses in the case of people who succeeded at building unicorn startups. It's not about money or class, it's about success in a particular field and judgement of that particular field.
      - Mz 9y ago
        Sure. That's why they specified ...some startup multi-millionaire/billionaire ... Because money is not relevant to their point. /s Also, I hate the term "lifestyle business" because: http://micheleincalifornia.blogspot.com/2014/03/i-love-lucy-lifestyle-business-that.html http://micheleincalifornia.blogspot.com/2014/03/i-love-lucy-...
        coldtea 9y ago
        >Sure. That's why they specified ...some startup multi-millionaire/billionaire ... Because money is not relevant to their point. Yes, "sure". My argument was clear enough, and as the parent wrote "it's not about money or class, it's about success in a particular field and judgement of that particular field". What part of either seems difficult to parse? Obviously money is relevant to my point in so much as it serves as the proof of that startup/unicorn success. The idea, and it's bizarro that I have to state it again, is rather that if you're to sneer at somebody for not "making it big" with their business, it only makes sense if you do it while yourself having a bigger business. That's why I wrote millionaire/billionaire, not because I hold millionaires/billionaires in high esteem, or find it OK for them to look down on people. I just find it more logical for a more succesful in business person to sneer at a less succesful in business regarding the latters business success, than the opposite.
        Mz 9y ago
        Money is not the only measure of success. Yet it seems to far too often be the only one cited, whether on HN or elsewhere in the world. Your inability to see that your point is about money and classism while using net worth as THE measure of success worth noting is both frustrating and all too common.

colmvp 9y ago

I know hindsight is 20/20, but it's interesting to me that they could've created Airbnb, as they had both the reach and finances to potentially create a side-project that was specific to short-term rentals. They already had sublets and temporary rentals as a sub-listing since forever. I know that Airbnb comes across as warm and fuzzy hosts who engage with guests, but it's progressively more commercialized with a good portion of hosts either managing multiple short-term rental properties or dedicating a space specifically for the purposes of consistently having short-term rentals.

MR4D 9y ago
If I had to bet which would last longer between Craigslist and AirBnB, I would pick Craigslist. I may be wrong, but I think it's the better bet for the long term.
smelendez 9y ago
That would have completely changed the company, though. Airbnb works by introducing ratings, insurance and being an intermediary someone can at least theoretically call if a renter is crazy or the listing isn't as advertised. Craigslist has 50 employees and minimal vetting of anything. It's great for what it is, but I would never use it to rent anything site unseen.
- cgriswald 9y ago
  > Craigslist has 50 employees and minimal vetting of anything. It's great for what it is, but I would never use it to rent anything site unseen. This is one reality show I would watch. Forget all those "We sleep in a dark place recording all the sounds buildings make and then speculate wildly about causes" shows. Sleeping overnight in a house/room/whatever rented randomly off Craigslist would be way more interesting and probably frequently more frightening.
  - jayjay71 9y ago
    I hope someone reads this and makes it a reality.

sreitshamer 9y ago

Niche FTW definitely. But I think it'd be hard to find something that's "steady". I run my own business and it's always changing -- the market's changing, the technologies are changing.