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Walmart needs to suck it up and rebrand its online store as a separate, more updated identity. My wife won't shop there "because Walmart". It isn't rational,

Walmart needs to suck it up and rebrand its online store as a separate, more updated identity. My wife won't shop there "because Walmart". It isn't rational, but it's a thing. Edit: to clarify, my wife won't shop on the walmart website. The physical stores are a different topic.

SpoilerAlert 9y ago
It could be rational: usually due to preconceived ideas of class, or perhaps product quality.
maxerickson 9y ago
Would it work? Or would the stigma just attach to the new brand?
- carsongross 9y ago
  Well, if you are going to force me to actually think about it rather than just fire off one liner advice on the internet to one of the most successful companies in the history of the world like I actually have any idea what I'm talking about: I would try it with some higher-end stuff first, relying on the same distribution system and then slowly moving the most popular online purchases over to it to ensure that the "walmart" feel is eliminated. I'd focus on a high end "organic produce" feel to the website. Target did something similar with it's "Up&Up" store brand stuff, and they have done it with clothing lines as well. The hard part is Walmart admitting to itself that it's image, particularly on the wealthy, online-shopping coasts, is not universally good, and slapping a wally-world star on things is going to drive a lot of good customers away.
- Digory 9y ago
  About the time Target began its long decline, James Lileks wrote about how he'd welcome a Target-alternative with short lines and clean, well-stocked stores ... IIRC, he suggested it could be called Samuels.
ashark 9y ago
Not going to their physical stores can be rational. The one nearest us is sadness made manifest. All the workers and shoppers seem like they hate life. Plus, no-one who shops there knows how to exist in a space with other people without constantly being in the way. The place can be 1/2 as busy as Target, and feel twice as busy because no-one there knows how to walk properly, nor do they seem aware there are other people in their world at all. Perhaps this relates to the intense sadness they all project. They seem lost in a fog, emphasis on lost. The checkout lines are also usually 2-3x as long as Target, no matter how busy or not-busy it is (they more aggressively cut employee hours to the bare minimum required to function, I'd guess). None of those apply online, though.
- maxerickson 9y ago
  The Walmart here is having trouble hiring. (which I understand means they aren't offering high enough pay and so on, but the staffing levels they maintain are an interaction of multiple factors, customer traffic, pricing expectations, etc., not just arbitrary cutting of hours)
- petra 9y ago
  Walmart has a solution for the WalMart atmosphere/class issues - offline-pickup. Order online, don't leave your car, and someone will place the order in the trunk.
- upvotinglurker 9y ago
  Interestingly, in my small midwestern US college town, I have the opposite experience. The college-associated people who consider themselves educated/intellectual/cultured gravitate toward grocery shopping at Kroger, while the "townies" and not-particularly-academically-serious undergrads go to Walmart. I choose Walmart because Kroger "feels" much more crowded and the members of the crowd seem to exhibit much less situational awareness.
  - intopieces 9y ago
    This sounds like Bloomington, IN. Except that town's Wal Mart crowd is mostly dictated by location. Kroger locations are walking distance and short bus ride, Wal Mart is predtically out of town.
ionised 9y ago
> because Walmart Why isn't that rational? She must have a reason.
- freehunter 9y ago
  The rational idea is not going to the store because you don't like the people or the climate there. The slightly less rational idea is that you won't shop at their online store because of the name association. You're not interacting with their customers or staff, but when you see the name you still feel the association with their customers and staff. Just because you can quantify why you feel that way doesn't make it rational. I don't like spiders because they look scary. I've never been bitten by one or even threatened by one, but I still don't like them. That's an irrational fear, even though I can tell you exactly why I don't like them. If you don't like Walmart because of its customers or staff, refusing to shop online with them is irrational.
  - ionised 9y ago
    > The slightly less rational idea is that you won't shop at their online store because of the name association. Yes, but why is the name association producing an aversion in this case? If it's simply a matter of not wanting to support a company you find ethically dubious for example (which would perfectly describe Walmart), then it would be perfectly rational to want to avoid it and all its associated ventures. Voting with your wallet and all that.
    - freehunter 9y ago
      Yeah it's not clear if the aversion is due to their corporate citizenship or the reality of the inside of their stores. One is rational, the other is not.
bryanlarsen 9y ago
I believe that's what they're doing with jet.com.
- carsongross 9y ago
  Interesting, I didn't know they bought jet.
  - dawnerd 9y ago
    I think that's the point.
iplaw 9y ago
Agreed. Walmart retail, both physical and online, does not exude class, quality, or customer support. As the article stated, Amazon has become well known as being customer-centric almost to a fault. I am confident when ordering anything from Amazon because I know that returns are quick and painless. Prime example: I ordered an expensive Toto toilet for my master bath remodel, and it arrived next-day for free. Even if the shipping cost was rolled into the price, I still paid $500 less than local suppliers. The contractor got the toilet fully installed the day of delivery and, during leak testing, we discovered a hairline crack in the one-piece ceramic tank. I contacted Amazon immediately and, the very next day, had a replacement Toto toilet on my doorstep and a UPS driver hauling the cracked toilet to his truck. I can't see Walmart ever providing this type of customer support.
- nyolfen 9y ago
  > As the article stated, Amazon has become well known as being customer-centric almost to a fault. I am confident when ordering anything from Amazon because I know that returns are quick and painless. i'm the opposite at this point. the surge in counterfeit, or low quality chinese shit comingled with previously good listings on amazon, has pushed me to let my prime lapse after six years, and i simply don't trust amazon for things other than books at this point. maybe that's just me and the things i shop for (mostly <$50 purchases), but returning things through the mail is a fucking pain and a huge friction.
  - chrisseaton 9y ago
    I don't think I've ever seen a counterfeit on Amazon. If you find them easily can you show me an example listing? I don't know if I'm gullible, or I don't browse the kind of products where they're found, or what.
    - laken 9y ago
      There's a big problem with it. Even Apple "has found nearly 90 percent of [their chargers and cables] to be counterfeit" on Amazon.[1] You could also read the reviews on listing for products such as the popular Yeti cooler mugs, and you'll find many people complaining about getting fakes (wrong color lid, etc.) [1] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-10-20/apple-many-genuine-apple-products-on-amazon-are-fake https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-10-20/apple-man... *edited for minor typo
spcelzrd 9y ago
I believe Walmart is a destructive force in society and I won't shop there. If they rebranded as something else, I wouldn't shop there.
- cpr 9y ago
  Agreed, but is Amazon really any better? Seems like they're (Amazon) the final nail in the coffin for many local businesses, after Walmart already put them there.
  - tmccrmck 9y ago
    Many of us also refuse to use Amazon.
- creepydata 9y ago
  Honest question, is Walmart worse than any other big box store (Lowe's, Home Depot, Target, Costco, Best Buy) and why?
  - treehau5 9y ago
    Speaking for Costco -- No, because they treat their employees well, provide good benefits and pay, and don't view their employees as just another cost to slash in order to increase shareholder value and corporate bonuses. Basically they treat their people as a priority. Speaking for Lowes and Home Depot -- Yes, because they view the human element of their labor as inputs in a function to get as much labor as humanly cheap as possible, circumventing as many laws as possible, to increase shareholder value and corporate bonuses. Basically they treat their people as a liability. (If I have one anecdote that basically sums up Lowe's C-levels: They treat technology and people as a cost. When we asked 49,000 dollars to upgrade a server room that was practically a fire hazard, we had to pull teeth. When it came time to spend 21 million dollars to upgrade their private jetliner so that it could make it to China in one trip, instead of having to stop and refuel, they approved the cost unanimously, almost without thought. Money that amounts to basically a drop in the bucket to make your job, a core function of our daily operations, much better? Nah. 21 million so we can fly to China faster every time the need arises to find more workers to exploit for cheap labor and then resell here in America for 90% markup? Heck yes.) Finally, I can't speak for Target because I have no idea about them. The common element here: People, and how you treat them.
dkrich 9y ago
They're already doing this to an extent by buying up private label ecommerce brands.
creepydata 9y ago
Walmart bought jet.com so jet.com should fulfill that role.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
htrp 9y ago
To be fair, the walmart website is barely responsive, has very little filtering/differentiation features and has a search that works every alternating thursday.

SpoilerAlert 9y ago

It could be rational: usually due to preconceived ideas of class, or perhaps product quality.

maxerickson 9y ago

Would it work? Or would the stigma just attach to the new brand?

carsongross 9y ago
Well, if you are going to force me to actually think about it rather than just fire off one liner advice on the internet to one of the most successful companies in the history of the world like I actually have any idea what I'm talking about: I would try it with some higher-end stuff first, relying on the same distribution system and then slowly moving the most popular online purchases over to it to ensure that the "walmart" feel is eliminated. I'd focus on a high end "organic produce" feel to the website. Target did something similar with it's "Up&Up" store brand stuff, and they have done it with clothing lines as well. The hard part is Walmart admitting to itself that it's image, particularly on the wealthy, online-shopping coasts, is not universally good, and slapping a wally-world star on things is going to drive a lot of good customers away.
Digory 9y ago
About the time Target began its long decline, James Lileks wrote about how he'd welcome a Target-alternative with short lines and clean, well-stocked stores ... IIRC, he suggested it could be called Samuels.

ashark 9y ago

Not going to their physical stores can be rational. The one nearest us is sadness made manifest. All the workers and shoppers seem like they hate life. Plus, no-one who shops there knows how to exist in a space with other people without constantly being in the way. The place can be 1/2 as busy as Target, and feel twice as busy because no-one there knows how to walk properly, nor do they seem aware there are other people in their world at all. Perhaps this relates to the intense sadness they all project. They seem lost in a fog, emphasis on lost. The checkout lines are also usually 2-3x as long as Target, no matter how busy or not-busy it is (they more aggressively cut employee hours to the bare minimum required to function, I'd guess). None of those apply online, though.

maxerickson 9y ago
The Walmart here is having trouble hiring. (which I understand means they aren't offering high enough pay and so on, but the staffing levels they maintain are an interaction of multiple factors, customer traffic, pricing expectations, etc., not just arbitrary cutting of hours)
petra 9y ago
Walmart has a solution for the WalMart atmosphere/class issues - offline-pickup. Order online, don't leave your car, and someone will place the order in the trunk.
upvotinglurker 9y ago
Interestingly, in my small midwestern US college town, I have the opposite experience. The college-associated people who consider themselves educated/intellectual/cultured gravitate toward grocery shopping at Kroger, while the "townies" and not-particularly-academically-serious undergrads go to Walmart. I choose Walmart because Kroger "feels" much more crowded and the members of the crowd seem to exhibit much less situational awareness.
- intopieces 9y ago
  This sounds like Bloomington, IN. Except that town's Wal Mart crowd is mostly dictated by location. Kroger locations are walking distance and short bus ride, Wal Mart is predtically out of town.

ionised 9y ago

> because Walmart Why isn't that rational? She must have a reason.

freehunter 9y ago
The rational idea is not going to the store because you don't like the people or the climate there. The slightly less rational idea is that you won't shop at their online store because of the name association. You're not interacting with their customers or staff, but when you see the name you still feel the association with their customers and staff. Just because you can quantify why you feel that way doesn't make it rational. I don't like spiders because they look scary. I've never been bitten by one or even threatened by one, but I still don't like them. That's an irrational fear, even though I can tell you exactly why I don't like them. If you don't like Walmart because of its customers or staff, refusing to shop online with them is irrational.
- ionised 9y ago
  > The slightly less rational idea is that you won't shop at their online store because of the name association. Yes, but why is the name association producing an aversion in this case? If it's simply a matter of not wanting to support a company you find ethically dubious for example (which would perfectly describe Walmart), then it would be perfectly rational to want to avoid it and all its associated ventures. Voting with your wallet and all that.
  - freehunter 9y ago
    Yeah it's not clear if the aversion is due to their corporate citizenship or the reality of the inside of their stores. One is rational, the other is not.

bryanlarsen 9y ago

I believe that's what they're doing with jet.com.

carsongross 9y ago
Interesting, I didn't know they bought jet.
- dawnerd 9y ago
  I think that's the point.

iplaw 9y ago

Agreed. Walmart retail, both physical and online, does not exude class, quality, or customer support. As the article stated, Amazon has become well known as being customer-centric almost to a fault. I am confident when ordering anything from Amazon because I know that returns are quick and painless. Prime example: I ordered an expensive Toto toilet for my master bath remodel, and it arrived next-day for free. Even if the shipping cost was rolled into the price, I still paid $500 less than local suppliers. The contractor got the toilet fully installed the day of delivery and, during leak testing, we discovered a hairline crack in the one-piece ceramic tank. I contacted Amazon immediately and, the very next day, had a replacement Toto toilet on my doorstep and a UPS driver hauling the cracked toilet to his truck. I can't see Walmart ever providing this type of customer support.

nyolfen 9y ago
> As the article stated, Amazon has become well known as being customer-centric almost to a fault. I am confident when ordering anything from Amazon because I know that returns are quick and painless. i'm the opposite at this point. the surge in counterfeit, or low quality chinese shit comingled with previously good listings on amazon, has pushed me to let my prime lapse after six years, and i simply don't trust amazon for things other than books at this point. maybe that's just me and the things i shop for (mostly <$50 purchases), but returning things through the mail is a fucking pain and a huge friction.
- chrisseaton 9y ago
  I don't think I've ever seen a counterfeit on Amazon. If you find them easily can you show me an example listing? I don't know if I'm gullible, or I don't browse the kind of products where they're found, or what.
  - laken 9y ago
    There's a big problem with it. Even Apple "has found nearly 90 percent of [their chargers and cables] to be counterfeit" on Amazon.[1] You could also read the reviews on listing for products such as the popular Yeti cooler mugs, and you'll find many people complaining about getting fakes (wrong color lid, etc.) [1] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-10-20/apple-many-genuine-apple-products-on-amazon-are-fake https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-10-20/apple-man... *edited for minor typo

spcelzrd 9y ago

I believe Walmart is a destructive force in society and I won't shop there. If they rebranded as something else, I wouldn't shop there.

cpr 9y ago
Agreed, but is Amazon really any better? Seems like they're (Amazon) the final nail in the coffin for many local businesses, after Walmart already put them there.
- tmccrmck 9y ago
  Many of us also refuse to use Amazon.
creepydata 9y ago
Honest question, is Walmart worse than any other big box store (Lowe's, Home Depot, Target, Costco, Best Buy) and why?
- treehau5 9y ago
  Speaking for Costco -- No, because they treat their employees well, provide good benefits and pay, and don't view their employees as just another cost to slash in order to increase shareholder value and corporate bonuses. Basically they treat their people as a priority. Speaking for Lowes and Home Depot -- Yes, because they view the human element of their labor as inputs in a function to get as much labor as humanly cheap as possible, circumventing as many laws as possible, to increase shareholder value and corporate bonuses. Basically they treat their people as a liability. (If I have one anecdote that basically sums up Lowe's C-levels: They treat technology and people as a cost. When we asked 49,000 dollars to upgrade a server room that was practically a fire hazard, we had to pull teeth. When it came time to spend 21 million dollars to upgrade their private jetliner so that it could make it to China in one trip, instead of having to stop and refuel, they approved the cost unanimously, almost without thought. Money that amounts to basically a drop in the bucket to make your job, a core function of our daily operations, much better? Nah. 21 million so we can fly to China faster every time the need arises to find more workers to exploit for cheap labor and then resell here in America for 90% markup? Heck yes.) Finally, I can't speak for Target because I have no idea about them. The common element here: People, and how you treat them.

dkrich 9y ago

They're already doing this to an extent by buying up private label ecommerce brands.

creepydata 9y ago

Walmart bought jet.com so jet.com should fulfill that role.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

htrp 9y ago

To be fair, the walmart website is barely responsive, has very little filtering/differentiation features and has a search that works every alternating thursday.