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Depresses me that Apple is trying to force real computers to stop being a thing just to try and make the iPad the true revolution that they still believe it is.

Depresses me that Apple is trying to force real computers to stop being a thing just to try and make the iPad the true revolution that they still believe it is. I feel Jobs saw the value in real computers even if a bit more locked down than self built they were still real computers. Compared to Cook who doesn't seem to understand or even like computers and thinks the future is in devices. I just don't see why Apple can't accept that iPads might be great for kids, people who purely use machines for consumption and my parents but iPads are worthless to some of us who need to actually use the full potential of computers.

votepaunchy 9y ago
What do you consider a "real computer"?
- evv 9y ago
  Personally I consider a computer "real" if you can use it to write its own software. Until you can actually develop iOS apps on iOS, it will just be a toy.
  - ry_ry 9y ago
    Wrote some code on an iPad this morning on my way to work. Never again. It's not even a question of the software being that of a glorified phone. Even using a 3rd party code editor with its software 'coding keyboard' it was an exercise in inefficiency and anti-ergonomics. So by the time you've added a Bluetooth keyboard, you've effectively got yourself a ramshackle laptop that isn't quite as useful as an actual laptop.
    - pharrlax 9y ago
      This is the problem with the iPad, on a fundamental level, for me. It's not a laptop, because it's missing crucial laptop features (ability to do work on it). And it's not a phone because it's missing crucial phone features (portability and calls). So when mine broke, I just didn't feel it was worth replacing. I've lost no value from not having an iPad, because everything it did could also be done on something else I own.
- m_fayer 9y ago
  A "general purpose" computer that will execute any appropriately compiled binary no questions asked.
  - thescriptkiddie 9y ago
    Reminds me of Cory Doctorow's essay "The coming war on general-purpose computing". https://boingboing.net/2012/01/10/lockdown.html https://boingboing.net/2012/01/10/lockdown.html
rahoulb 9y ago
Jobs didn't want 3rd party software on either the Mac or the iPhone and had to be persuaded to allow it by the rest of the team. Whilst I often wish I could install the local development environment of my choice onto my Pro, having seen the crap that grinds all my dad's computers to a halt (he's one of those that sees something and just installs it) the "sandbox the shit out of everything" approach really makes sense to me.
- majewsky 9y ago
  > the "sandbox the shit out of everything" approach really makes sense to me It's more than just sandboxes. Android grinds to a halt just easily when you install crappy apps. For example, I used a German classifieds app called Shpock for some time. After I uninstalled it, I noticed that I got around 50% more mileage out of my phone's battery. As far as I've heard, stuff like this is not as prevalent on iOS because Apple enforces stuff like background scheduling more strictly than Android does. It's not just the sandboxing, it's the behavior of the interfaces that the sandbox offers.
  - hunnefeldtyler 9y ago
    This is one of the areas that I really like about Apple, however frustrating it is for developers. There are only a few ways to run (non-finite) code while the app is backgrounded. Android seems to be taking a page out of iOS's book with the introduction of Android O and its restrictions to background services.

votepaunchy 9y ago

What do you consider a "real computer"?

evv 9y ago
Personally I consider a computer "real" if you can use it to write its own software. Until you can actually develop iOS apps on iOS, it will just be a toy.
- ry_ry 9y ago
  Wrote some code on an iPad this morning on my way to work. Never again. It's not even a question of the software being that of a glorified phone. Even using a 3rd party code editor with its software 'coding keyboard' it was an exercise in inefficiency and anti-ergonomics. So by the time you've added a Bluetooth keyboard, you've effectively got yourself a ramshackle laptop that isn't quite as useful as an actual laptop.
  - pharrlax 9y ago
    This is the problem with the iPad, on a fundamental level, for me. It's not a laptop, because it's missing crucial laptop features (ability to do work on it). And it's not a phone because it's missing crucial phone features (portability and calls). So when mine broke, I just didn't feel it was worth replacing. I've lost no value from not having an iPad, because everything it did could also be done on something else I own.
m_fayer 9y ago
A "general purpose" computer that will execute any appropriately compiled binary no questions asked.
- thescriptkiddie 9y ago
  Reminds me of Cory Doctorow's essay "The coming war on general-purpose computing". https://boingboing.net/2012/01/10/lockdown.html https://boingboing.net/2012/01/10/lockdown.html

rahoulb 9y ago

Jobs didn't want 3rd party software on either the Mac or the iPhone and had to be persuaded to allow it by the rest of the team. Whilst I often wish I could install the local development environment of my choice onto my Pro, having seen the crap that grinds all my dad's computers to a halt (he's one of those that sees something and just installs it) the "sandbox the shit out of everything" approach really makes sense to me.

majewsky 9y ago
> the "sandbox the shit out of everything" approach really makes sense to me It's more than just sandboxes. Android grinds to a halt just easily when you install crappy apps. For example, I used a German classifieds app called Shpock for some time. After I uninstalled it, I noticed that I got around 50% more mileage out of my phone's battery. As far as I've heard, stuff like this is not as prevalent on iOS because Apple enforces stuff like background scheduling more strictly than Android does. It's not just the sandboxing, it's the behavior of the interfaces that the sandbox offers.
- hunnefeldtyler 9y ago
  This is one of the areas that I really like about Apple, however frustrating it is for developers. There are only a few ways to run (non-finite) code while the app is backgrounded. Android seems to be taking a page out of iOS's book with the introduction of Android O and its restrictions to background services.